General Impressions

The story is only one aspect of Shenmue. If you take away the interactive parts of I & II -- the exploration, the atmosphere -- what's left is merely serviceable. There's nothing that remarkable about the story alone.

Back on topic, I can't imagine the treasure being treasure alone. The Emperor and Empress having a hidden treasure makes sense, but it can't just be gold. If you look at the scroll, there's some kind of orb floating above the treasure with flames surrounding it:

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There's a small chance this could represent the mirrors, but I don't think so. It features none of the distinct mirror markings, like the jewel that's in the middle of both of them, and it appears to have a shine to it like an orb.

By the end it seems like the mirrors were held in the same place as the treasure, the cliff temple, but we don't know that for sure. All Elder Yeh says about the treasure is it's "hidden in those mountains", so I'm not convinced yet. However, if the mirrors were held in the same place as the treasure, this would make sense if it also required those with royal blood to access -- ancestors, or perhaps modern-day reincarnations of the Dragon and Phoenix? :unsure:

Interesting, thanks for that... Yes to be fair that image does make the treasure seem to be more than literal... the Emperor/Empress link would suggest Shenhua being a Royal descendant when you consider that brief flashback during the Shenmue tree scene in S2. Maybe even Ryo himself is a descendant with the mystery hanging over his mother still (probably not though).
 
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I really don't see what I said as being ridiculous or mocking.
- Many people on Shenmuedojo alone state that the storytelling is worse.. wanna try gamefaqs? youtube comments?
- People aren't voicing their issues with the combat system? (I'll grant that mini-game physics are my personal gripe)
- There aren't articles out there reporting that sales are incredibly low? (albeit physic sales)
- You believe Shenmue 4 will get as large of a budget as Shenmue 3 after all the controversy?

I'm speaking plainly. I do not joke. This series is in hot water and we would be lucky to get a recognizable sequel if even a sequel at all as long as we chase this video game standard. Yu's vision is butchered as a result.
nothing you’re saying means anything. Shenmue is a video game series. Ys Net is a studio that makes video games. Why do you keep moaning about anime and comic books? Why would Yu Suzuki, a veteran video game developer, want to release either of these things? Why do you think creating a quality anime or manga is cheap? Who would they hire to write or direct one of these things? Why do you think the majority of people who have interest in Shenmue the video game would suddenly be interested in a completely different kind of medium? You’re just spouting nonsense, dude. Sorry to break the news to you.

Personally, I hope Martin Scorsese gets the rights to Shenmue and makes a live action crime epic. Thatd save the series!
 
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Having just finished off Bailu for the second time I have to say I really loved it. There's much more there than its given credit for IMO. Taking the time to talk to everyone, listen to the conversations develop, made me feel right at home. Leaving was a chore it really was and I'd argue the ending of Bailu is probably the best cutscene in the entire game.
 
I fall in the middle of this debate between gameplay and story in Shenmue. Honestly what makes Shenmue a masterpiece in my eyes, is that it excels at both. If you have a good story in a video game but poor gameplay, you have an interactive movie. If you have the reverse, you have a good video game, but not a masterpiece.

One could argue that yes, Shenmue is the proverbial Kung-Fu revenge story. However, I would argue that its execution is what makes it so beloved. I did not cry at the end of Shenmue Chapter One: Yokosuka because I was leaving for Hong Kong, I was crying because I was leaving behind characters I genuinely cared about. Also there is no doubt in my mind that part of the reason Shenmue II had such a strong impact on fans over the years was because of how the second game ended. To say that Shenmue's story is nothing more than a typical Wuxia film, is to say that the original Star Wars films is nothing more than the proverbial Heroes Journey set in space.

On the other hand, to pretend that the gameplay is secondary to the story is not true either. Shenmue is a video game after all, so gameplay is paramount. What makes Shenmue unique even to this day, is its abundant detail. Why this interaction is important is that dovetails right in with the story. The smaller details not only give each player a unique experience, but also fleshes out the world and its characters more. The smaller elements help give the larger elements in the story more meaning behind them; because they further increase your immersion in the world.

Personally say what you want about the execution of Shenmue III's story, but saying that Shenmue should focus only on story or gameplay is shortsighted in my opinion. Because when you execute both well you get an unforgettable experience. At the end of the day, I could live on Shenmue just focusing on ambience and martial arts, but they are only a few parts of a much larger whole.
 
I fall in the middle of this debate between gameplay and story in Shenmue. Honestly what makes Shenmue a masterpiece in my eyes, is that it excels at both. If you have a good story in a video game but poor gameplay, you have an interactive movie. If you have the reverse, you have a good video game, but not a masterpiece.

One could argue that yes, Shenmue is the proverbial Kung-Fu revenge story. However, I would argue that its execution is what makes it so beloved. I did not cry at the end of Shenmue Chapter One: Yokosuka because I was leaving for Hong Kong, I was crying because I was leaving behind characters I genuinely cared about. Also there is no doubt in my mind that part of the reason Shenmue II had such a strong impact on fans over the years was because of how the second game ended. To say that Shenmue's story is nothing more than a typical Wuxia film, is to say that the original Star Wars films is nothing more than the proverbial Heroes Journey set in space.

On the other hand, to pretend that the gameplay is secondary to the story is not true either. Shenmue is a video game after all, so gameplay is paramount. What makes Shenmue unique even to this day, is its abundant detail. Why this interaction is important is that dovetails right in with the story. The smaller details not only give each player a unique experience, but also fleshes out the world and its characters more. The smaller elements help give the larger elements in the story more meaning behind them; because they further increase your immersion in the world.

Personally say what you want about the execution of Shenmue III's story, but saying that Shenmue should focus only on story or gameplay is shortsighted in my opinion. Because when you execute both well you get an unforgettable experience. At the end of the day, I could live on Shenmue just focusing on ambience and martial arts, but they are only a few parts of a much larger whole.
I agree with all of that- I did say the immersion was as important as the story and they went hand in hand.
I only meant that going forward the story takes on more importance for me as the full story needs to be told.... And I would accept that in a non game format (or in a reduced more linear game format perhaps) if it meant it was more achievable.
 
Having just finished off Bailu for the second time I have to say I really loved it. There's much more there than its given credit for IMO. Taking the time to talk to everyone, listen to the conversations develop, made me feel right at home. Leaving was a chore it really was and I'd argue the ending of Bailu is probably the best cutscene in the entire game.

Have to agree. Bailu for me was awesome. I loved everything about it. But when I went to Niaowu the game just seemed to go down hill progressively until the last 30 mins.
 
One could argue that yes, Shenmue is the proverbial Kung-Fu revenge story. However, I would argue that its execution is what makes it so beloved. I did not cry at the end of Shenmue Chapter One: Yokosuka because I was leaving for Hong Kong, I was crying because I was leaving behind characters I genuinely cared about. Also there is no doubt in my mind that part of the reason Shenmue II had such a strong impact on fans over the years was because of how the second game ended. To say that Shenmue's story is nothing more than a typical Wuxia film, is to say that the original Star Wars films is nothing more than the proverbial Heroes Journey set in space.
I think it's fine to say Shenmue is a typical Wuxia story, but what makes the story special is how it's executed as a video game. It's not a knock against the game. I 100% agree that it's a balance between gameplay and story -- without the gameplay you lose too much of what makes it special and unique in the first place.
 
"The cartoony graphical style chosen for NPCs in this game is not good, and the graphics of NPCs should resemble realism just like the original games did."

For me this was an HUGE issue! Most of the NPCs looks just stupid. Even the main villains.


I wouldnt say most. I only had a problem with:

The three dock workers in Niaowu that you can fight in the Rose Garden tournament
Mr Muscles.
The goofy skinny Red Snakes guy.
Yongling (fist of the north star looking thug in Bailu). Mainly just his clothes and hair though.
kung fu panda guy in Niaowu (Grandmaster Bei's student). We already had a fat kung fu guy in Bailu did we really need another lol
The Nouveau rich couple in Niaowu. The husband looked straight out of Dragon Quest lol
Lastly, while I didnt mind her much, the Niaowu hotel lady was a bit too much. Yes there are ugly women like that in the world, and I get that she was probably a parody of the woman in Kung Fu Hustle, but if she actually looked more toned down like that woman than itd have been more believable

Overall thats 10 characters.

side note: there shouldnt be a Chinese woman working as a shrine maiden in Japanese shrine maiden clothes in rural China. That just seemed really forced.
 
I doubt any game sequel over a decade in the waiting is going to live up to the expectations people set in their mind in nearly 20 years.

Beyond Good and Evil came out in 2003. I imagine the sequel (or prequel forget which it is) coming up regardless of its spectacle, will also meet or surpass people's expectations. And I imagine that game isnt coming out until at least 2021 if we're being generous.

Even FF VII Remake has people with contentious divisive reactions to it despite its visual spectacle

And of course look what happened to Duke Nukem Forever.

When you have to wait +10 years, things change over time and other things influence your perception.

Case in point this Shenmue game. A lot of people expected it to be a huge epic on par with 100 million AAA budget games. That was never going to happen.
 
I doubt any game sequel over a decade in the waiting is going to live up to the expectations people set in their mind in nearly 20 years.

Beyond Good and Evil came out in 2003. I imagine the sequel (or prequel forget which it is) coming up regardless of its spectacle, will also meet or surpass people's expectations. And I imagine that game isnt coming out until at least 2021 if we're being generous.

Even FF VII Remake has people with contentious divisive reactions to it despite its visual spectacle

And of course look what happened to Duke Nukem Forever.

When you have to wait +10 years, things change over time and other things influence your perception.

Case in point this Shenmue game. A lot of people expected it to be a huge epic on par with 100 million AAA budget games. That was never going to happen.
I agree, except for the last part as I don't think anyone expected it to be a 100m budget at all- the whole KS funding method made the budget very transparent, and I think expectations were largely lowered as a result.
In terms of the quality, size and detail of the world it actually exceeded my expectations, I'm just very disappointed in the quality of the story telling and to slightly duplicate another topic on here I don't think the budget is inherently the cause of that. Of course things got cut etc. as they ran out of money (and time I imagine) but it would seem to me that the primary focus of the budget was to build this great world, rather than tell the story within it....
 
I doubt any game sequel over a decade in the waiting is going to live up to the expectations people set in their mind in nearly 20 years.

Beyond Good and Evil came out in 2003. I imagine the sequel (or prequel forget which it is) coming up regardless of its spectacle, will also meet or surpass people's expectations. And I imagine that game isnt coming out until at least 2021 if we're being generous.

Even FF VII Remake has people with contentious divisive reactions to it despite its visual spectacle

And of course look what happened to Duke Nukem Forever.

When you have to wait +10 years, things change over time and other things influence your perception.

Case in point this Shenmue game. A lot of people expected it to be a huge epic on par with 100 million AAA budget games. That was never going to happen.
Well to be fair being wary of the FF7 remake is not a bad thing being sliced in episodes and for what it seems square is not sure it will greenlight the 3 o 4 extra games it will need to complete the story.

They might end up in a pseudo Shenmue situation if they manage that project as well as the FF13 versus...
 
I doubt any game sequel over a decade in the waiting is going to live up to the expectations people set in their mind in nearly 20 years.

Beyond Good and Evil came out in 2003. I imagine the sequel (or prequel forget which it is) coming up regardless of its spectacle, will also meet or surpass people's expectations. And I imagine that game isnt coming out until at least 2021 if we're being generous.

Even FF VII Remake has people with contentious divisive reactions to it despite its visual spectacle

And of course look what happened to Duke Nukem Forever.

When you have to wait +10 years, things change over time and other things influence your perception.

Case in point this Shenmue game. A lot of people expected it to be a huge epic on par with 100 million AAA budget games. That was never going to happen.
Very good points here. I was also a huge Duke Nukem fan as a kid and Forever left me no longer caring about the series... Not that Shenmue III was anything remotely like the trainwreck of DNF, but just the long long decade of waiting can make it extremely hard to produce a sequel of high praise when the demographics change so much.
 
Eh this was more like the training section of shenmue so i'd hope 4 would reveal alot more. I would really want it to stay as a game, if it were an anime i'd watch it because I want to know more but it just wouldn't feel the same lol
 
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