Final time Ryo fights Lan Di...

[Nostalgic Hunger]

..Assuming current battle system will carry on to Shenmue 4 and 5, how do you think the final fight with Lan Di will be presented gameplay wise:

1. Lan Di is still untouchable, but Ryo now being stronger, can deplete Lan Di's "defence bar" and connect a hit.
2. Lan Di conveniently regresses to, while high damaging, but otherwise standard enemy who Ryo is finally "allowed" to beat.
3. Fight with Lan Di becomes environmental one, where fight is not about test of martial art skill but rather a question of "hit this object to distract invincible Lan Di so you can deal damage to him".

I hope for the first option, would be disappointed with third, and absolutely hate the second.
EDIT: Probably would still hate the third option more than the second.

What are your options and/or which from the above would you prefer?

 

[Vivi-gamer]

I reckon the next conflict with Lan Di Ryo will match skills with him - sort of similar to the fight with Guizhang where both wear each other out in Shenmue 1. The final encounter with Lan Di in Shemnue 3 was perfect - Although it could have lasted about double the length maybe but the concept of Ryo not landing a hit had me in awe!

While I was disappointing with the lack of personal and combat progress Ryo gained in Shenmue 3 (I really wanted a heavier sense of him being mentored sort of like how Xiuying was in Shen 2.) I'm hoping Shenmue 4 will cause Ryo to reach that sense of next level Martial Arts Mastery.

While I think an even fight might be a little unrealistic I think after their encounter in Shen 3 they need to at least show some sense of progression. I don't want Lan Di to be weakened by some other character or environmental hazard. Martial Arts run deep into the core of Shenmue's experience so I want to see Ryo become stronger and be able to rise to the challenge.

Of course with the way Shenmue's production has been, the journey might be a little more compressed then original expected, so while I sort of want to say Shenmue V is the game where Ryo meets Lan Di's skill, I think a similar battle might take place at the end of the next game - But once again I hope that if this is the case we see a huge sense of progression in Ryo's skill and training. Also, it also depends on where the narrative falls, if it ends with Lan Di or if it continues further upon the Chi You Men.

 

[Demon's Triangle]

It would take some plot maneuvering, but I'll love it if the final battle between them took place in the Hazuki dojo where it all began. Lan Di isn't just facing Ryo but the ghosts of his past, and that he killed Iwao for the wrong reasons.

I imagine during the battle, flashes of all the masters throughtout the series, triggering mid battle QTEs based on the moves they taught you. It's a ferocious battle, Lan Di prepares a final move and taunts Ryo, he experiences the flashback of his father practising under the cherry tree, teaching him how to find ''his center of balance" Ryo uses Elbow Assault, and strikes Lan Di down. Ryo has a moment to finish him, but refuses, he was fighting to buy Shenhua time. (To destroy, unseal the Mirrors or whatever she needs to do in the climax)

Imo the final battle should take place either in the dojo, Meng Cun where Sunming died, or in front of the Shenmue tree as the CYM invade Bailu Village in one final retaliation.

 

[hmjohnny]

I don't think Ryo will ever beat Lan Di, at least not in a traditional one-on-one fight. It's possible that he gets strong enough by the end of the series to land a single blow, but even that means he becomes stronger than his father at such a young age.

I think Lan Di will die, but not by Ryo's hands. It's possible they never even fight again. Given that Shenmue started as VF RGP I can see it ending with Ryo vowing to continue his training rather than becoming a master.

 

[Naoyuki]

Dunno but I think it will be a mental battle more than anything (in traditional virtua fighter kinda style, but with power moves at various points).

IMO Ryo will learn, but not quite master Lan Di's style, so he'll need a POD to exploit Lan Di's weaknesses (anger, revenge, list for power...etc). This POD will be something selfless that will require a level of moral fortitude... possibly one that's linked to their fathers.

 

[danielmann861]

My thought was always that we would get 3 rounds in classic fighting game scenario.

First round: goes to Lan Di. Like everyone kept telling him, Ryo had no chance against Lan Di and we saw that in SIII. They all kept telling him but he would not have it...but just as Lan Di is about to kill him, fate steps in to intevene (which is basically what happened with Ren in SIII)

Second round: Lan Di dominates the match, but Ryo finally sees an opening and gets one major blow that knocks Lan Di to the ground and has an opening; but same scenario. Something will intervene allowing Lan Di to get away. This will be Ryo's dark side moment where he gets an oppurtunity to do it but fate says otherwise. Kind of what Super Eye Patch suggested, but this time it's actually an earned moment as it shows Ryo has learned something from his first fight with Lan Di. He has learned something from his greatest opponent.

Third Round: Ryo finally fights an even fight with Lan Di...and gets the final blow leaving Lan Di on the ground...but alas, he will not kill Lan Di because Ryo will hopefully have learned to put his hate behind him and accept this is far bigger than just his father. Hopefully by that point, there will be an understanding between both men about how they were both mistaken in what actually occurred between Iwao and Lan Di's dad. Ryo will get the final victory...but he won't kill Lan Di now that some great truth has been revealed. Instead of getting revenge, he will have finally become the great warrior and protector he was destined to become.

I like the idea of three rounds. First round: It's all Lan Di. Second round: goes to Ryo just barely. Third round: Ryo is at his strongest and fights an even fight to finally win but learns something greater in life and finally puts the hate aside.

 

[Demon's Triangle]

My thought was always that we would get 3 rounds in classic fighting game scenario.

First round: goes to Lan Di. Like everyone kept telling him, Ryo had no chance against Lan Di and we saw that in SIII. They all kept telling him but he would not have it...but just as Lan Di is about to kill him, fate steps in to intevene (which is basically what happened with Ren in SIII)

Second round: Lan Di dominates the match, but Ryo finally sees an opening and gets one major blow that knocks Lan Di to the ground and has an opening; but same scenario. Something will intervene allowing Lan Di to get away. This will be Ryo's dark side moment where he gets an oppurtunity to do it but fate says otherwise. Kind of what Super Eye Patch suggested, but this time it's actually an earned moment as it shows Ryo has learned something from his first fight with Lan Di. He has learned something from his greatest opponent.

Third Round: Ryo finally fights an even fight with Lan Di...and gets the final blow leaving Lan Di on the ground...but alas, he will not kill Lan Di because Ryo will hopefully have learned to put his hate behind him and accept this is far bigger than just his father. Hopefully by that point, there will be an understanding between both men about how they were both mistaken in what actually occurred between Iwao and Lan Di's dad. Ryo will get the final victory...but he won't kill Lan Di now that some great truth has been revealed. Instead of getting revenge, he will have finally become the great warrior and protector he was destined to become.

I like the idea of three rounds. First round: It's all Lan Di. Second round: goes to Ryo just barely. Third round: Ryo is at his strongest and fights an even fight to finally win but learns something greater in life and finally puts the hate aside.

Second round I imagine being a draw but a bigger enemy like Tentei interrupts them (true 5th leader of the CYM) and a twist is revealed.

 

[Dehone]

I dont see Lan Di getting distracted by anything. Maybe throw him if with a feign or something, but that's it

 

[Naoyuki]

I dont see Lan Di getting distracted by anything. Maybe throw him if with a feign or something, but that's it

Somebody will find a way to hit him eventually.

Alternatively... I'm open to Lan Di and Ryo somehow teaming up. I mean to me it's not clear where Lan Di goes off to at the end of Shenmue III or what will happen to the Chi You Men. Presumably he realises they've all been scammed and this plays out in whatever he does next (I doubt he dives out the window of the castle and goes diving for the fake mirror).

I mean... now Lan Di (possibly a free agent, not Chi You Men?) has the dragon mirror and Niao Sun has the phoenix mirror. Ryo has what, the map? (Which only Chai seems to care about - not clear who he serves). Of course, this assumes that Niao Sun (who is a true psychopath... damn they did her well) doesn't hold both.

But yeah... I almost forgot that Shenmue III didn't progress the story at all. Nothing happened. So boring... [/sarcasm]

 

[BruceWayne911]

I can't see Ryo beating Lan Di, based off Shenmue 3 Ryo can't even touch him. There are so many people we have met throughout the Shenmue series that Ryo was no match for. Lan Di is by far the strongest doe in the Shenmue universe.

What if Lan Di falls victim to a environmental hazard. We know that the Phoenix and Dragon mirrors reveal a great treasure. Maybe this same hazard is what befell Suming Zhao. Grandmaster Bei is flawlessly beating Ryo with no effort. Iwao was a master that taught Ryo everything he knows and Lan Di looked like he was playing Dance Dance Revolution at the arcade instead of fighting a martial arts master. Lan Di killed this man with a Hadouken. Akuma would be proud.

 

[Dehone]

Somebody will find a way to hit him eventually.

Alternatively... I'm open to Lan Di and Ryo somehow teaming up. I mean to me it's not clear where Lan Di goes off to at the end of Shenmue III or what will happen to the Chi You Men. Presumably he realises they've all been scammed and this plays out in whatever he does next (I doubt he dives out the window of the castle and goes diving for the fake mirror).

I mean... now Lan Di (possibly a free agent, not Chi You Men?) has the dragon mirror and Niao Sun has the phoenix mirror. Ryo has what, the map? (Which only Chai seems to care about - not clear who he serves). Of course, this assumes that Niao Sun (who is a true psychopath... damn they did her well) doesn't hold both.

But yeah... I almost forgot that Shenmue III didn't progress the story at all. Nothing happened. So boring... [/sarcasm]

Lan Di got screwed over by only one of the Chi You Men. There are still two others I believe so it may not be a complete break away the organization yet with Lan Di and dont really see them teaming up a this point, especially if he doesn't see Ryo as a capable martial artist at this point.

Chai said in S1 that it was his dream to work for Lan Di specifically so he's likely still loyal to him, although he could be to Niao Sun too.

 

[danielmann861]

Somebody will find a way to hit him eventually.

Alternatively... I'm open to Lan Di and Ryo somehow teaming up. I mean to me it's not clear where Lan Di goes off to at the end of Shenmue III or what will happen to the Chi You Men. Presumably he realises they've all been scammed and this plays out in whatever he does next (I doubt he dives out the window of the castle and goes diving for the fake mirror).

I mean... now Lan Di (possibly a free agent, not Chi You Men?) has the dragon mirror and Niao Sun has the phoenix mirror. Ryo has what, the map? (Which only Chai seems to care about - not clear who he serves). Of course, this assumes that Niao Sun (who is a true psychopath... damn they did her well) doesn't hold both.

But yeah... I almost forgot that Shenmue III didn't progress the story at all. Nothing happened. So boring... [/sarcasm]

Yeap...SIII was all for nothing...no plot development whatsoever

 

[Naoyuki]

Lan Di got screwed over by only one of the Chi You Men.

Yeah we're yet to meet them and feel their vibes ay! I think it's difficult to predict how it'll all play out until we run into them.

I mean... unsuccessfully betraying and then trying to murder your leader isn't a particularly good way to establish yourself as the new leader. If anything, she's now cemented herself as a liability (and Ryo knows her face so like any spy, her value's now been spent in terms of being able to infiltrate his camp). Hmmm... she could help him defeat Lan Di though. So many pieces to this puzzle!

it may not be a complete break away the organization yet with Lan Di and dont really see them teaming up a this point, especially if he doesn't see Ryo as a capable martial artist at this point.

Agreed. There's no logical reason for them to join each other and both are still angry about their fathers' deaths regardless.

My gut feeling is that Ryo's gonna be torn between killing Lan Di, protecting the treasure and fulfilling the prophecy. Damn... I'm probably way off about everything. VERY MUCH looking forward to Shenmue IV.

 

[Demon's Triangle]

Somebody will find a way to hit him eventually.

Alternatively... I'm open to Lan Di and Ryo somehow teaming up. I mean to me it's not clear where Lan Di goes off to at the end of Shenmue III or what will happen to the Chi You Men. Presumably he realises they've all been scammed and this plays out in whatever he does next (I doubt he dives out the window of the castle and goes diving for the fake mirror).

I mean... now Lan Di (possibly a free agent, not Chi You Men?) has the dragon mirror and Niao Sun has the phoenix mirror. Ryo has what, the map? (Which only Chai seems to care about - not clear who he serves). Of course, this assumes that Niao Sun (who is a true psychopath... damn they did her well) doesn't hold both.

But yeah... I almost forgot that Shenmue III didn't progress the story at all. Nothing happened. So boring... [/sarcasm]

The true 5th leader, Tentei, could unite the Chi You Men, following Sun's defeat in the civil war, and Lan Di might need all the allies he can get, with him being declared an enemy of the CYM. If Tentei has a secret identity like Yuandha Zhu, (Two personas, roles like Palpatine/Darth Sideous) I can imagine Lan Di teaming up with Ryo's group against their mutual enemy.

 

[Revan]

I think it will be a case of the first scenario with Ryo becoming stronger to overcome Lan Di, that's where this series feels as though it's headed.

The final boss fights in Shenmue (S1: Chai, S2: Dou Niu, S3: Longqi Ge) all seem to follow the same structure. The first phase of the fight is a free battle, and then the second phase is a QTE sequence. I think the same structure will happen with the Lan Di fight, and Ryo will use all the special Bajiquan moves he has learned during the series in the QTE phase of the battle.

So far he's learned S2's Counter Elbow Assault and S3's The Body Check/The Reverse Body Check.



Assuming there's one special Bajiquan technique taught per game, there are still two techniques that Ryo needs to learn. I imagine that only when Ryo uses all four of these moves in the QTE phase of the fight, will he then be strong enough to defeat Lan Di.

Ryo defeating Lan Di with four special moves could appear a bit contrived, but it would follow video game logic ('Collect these four MacGuffins to defeat the bad guy').

 

[Demon's Triangle]

I can't see Ryo beating Lan Di, based off Shenmue 3 Ryo can't even touch him. There are so many people we have met throughout the Shenmue series that Ryo was no match for. Lan Di is by far the strongest doe in the Shenmue universe.

What if Lan Di falls victim to a environmental hazard. We know that the Phoenix and Dragon mirrors reveal a great treasure. Maybe this same hazard is what befell Suming Zhao. Grandmaster Bei is flawlessly beating Ryo with no effort. Iwao was a master that taught Ryo everything he knows and Lan Di looked like he was playing Dance Dance Revolution at the arcade instead of fighting a martial arts master. Lan Di killed this man with a Hadouken. Akuma would be proud.

An enviromental hazard could be a cheat. I think there should be internal logic to it, like Ryo deciphers Iwao's hidden scrolls move (and Xiuying's Demon Triangle not used in 3) and Ryo staggers Lan Di defenses. He loses his cool, because he learnt the truth about his father's death, and he loses his focus, giving Ryo an oppurtunity

There's some concept art of Lan Di with his hair down, unruly, I can imagine that, unhinged and ferocious Lan Di.. but suceptible to attacks. In their first battle Ryo was the agressor and overcome with emotions, the tables could turn.