So has shenmue 3 undone anything from 1&2

Zhenmue

Zhenmue

Joined
Nov 27, 2019
for the most part for me not really just a few niggling retconds but nothing major like the sword now being a dagger and the reference to the mirrors being from ancient times alogh that could be explained the myth about the mirrors being basses on an ancient mythology but the reality of them existing and being made more recent but that's more due to a lack of clarity rather than a contradiction

Infact most of the issues that are with the game are a lack of explanation rather than any real contradiction thus far

Tone wise it feels and plays like shenmue for the most part and I still have enthusiasm for the franchise by I do feel.some maker revalations been to happen in 4

But yea I don't feel this is a star wars prequal situation with all kinds of metaclurans and anikin made c3p0 levels of dumb that just breaks the whole story

Shenmue 3 has some shaky aspects but imo it's still a respectable chapter in the saga

What are your thoughts
 
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For the most part I agree, but I think there was some very questionable storytelling going on in the game. Why are there two Shenmue trees, maybe even more? That's not a minor point imho, the game is called Shenmue and one of its protagonists is called "Shen Flower".

Also does the prophecy being ignored was weird, although that may still be explained. Again, nothing minor. The prophecy is the prologue to all three games. Don't press anything on the start screen of any Shenmue game and you'll get Shenhua reading that poem for you.

As for how S3 will hold up in comparison to the rest of the series really depends on what story the remaining games have to tell. I think S3 may well end up being a respectable entry in the series but we'll have to see how certain things it set up play out.
 
The only contradiction that even remotely bothers me is that Bailu is a little more advanced than we were lead to believe in Shenmue II.
 
code l name said:
That’s a good catch. As @danielmann861 said the mistranslation especially on pivotal story moments is terrible!
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Yeah it's horrendous and isn't the only one. I dread to think how many more there are.

That said the small changes in 3 don't bother me. Though the context of these wont be felt until Shenmue 4
 
KidMarine said:
The only contradiction that even remotely bothers me is that Bailu is a little more advanced than we were lead to believe in Shenmue II.
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Ah yes that was a bit of a contradiction especially when in 2 shenua sounds perplexed about arcades a d forklift trucks and such lol
 
KidMarine said:
The only contradiction that even remotely bothers me is that Bailu is a little more advanced than we were lead to believe in Shenmue II.
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Yeah it doesn't make sense narratively that they'd have that arcade. I had to suspend disbelief on that point a bit. Suzuki probably didn't have complete faith in the pacing & put it there so Shenewbs would have something to kill a little time with.
 
spud1897 said:
Yeah it's horrendous and isn't the only one. I dread to think how many more there are.

That said the small changes in 3 don't bother me. Though the context of these wont be felt until Shenmue 4
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Wow. Just wow.

Reading this does clarify the question of the two Shenmue trees but on the other hand it further lowers my opinion on S3.

They really have a lot to improve for S4 and proofreading a translation is something you'd think is the simplest thing.
 
None of the alterations bothered me. Personally, I think only one of them could have a lasting impact: the removal of the Luoyang painting in Shenhua's house. That could indicate we were meant to visit there and it's no longer happening...but that in itself is just a guess. Everything else, I think, is rather minor, or mistranslated from Japanese.
hyo_razuki said:
They really have a lot to improve for S4 and proofreading a translation is something you'd think is the simplest thing.
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Translating and editing giant game scripts is not as simple as it seems. That's why there are specialised localisation companies. The results can be heavily impacted by time and budget constraints, which is clearly what happened here. It shouldn't come as too much of a surprise considering both Shenmue and Shenmue II aren't exactly known for their excellent localisation and writing.
 
Anyone know what translations was apparently corrected with the most recent patch ?
 
Wouldn’t really consider these ‘minor retcons’ considering that the sword‘s supernatural background is very glaring and is something that has been theorized to death in the fandom for years. It played a huge role in making Shenmue 2’s ending as iconic as it was. The mirrors on the other hand, i think we need a bit more context before we determine whether their backstory is inconsistent but so far I’d say it doesn't add up.

I really hope they don’t go the “it was a myth” route when it comes to addressing the mirrors’ supernatural origins. It would feel like a cop out.
 
(SW's metacluran idea was not dumb though. It simply suggested Jedis were using different science at the time.)
 
Zhenmue said:
Anyone know what translations was apparently corrected with the most recent patch ?
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I doubt it, it would involve recording new lines.
 
Yokosuka said:
(SW's metacluran idea was not dumb though. It simply suggested Jedis were using different science at the time.)
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But it is kinda lame.to apply science to a mystical concept and it just felt clunky and undid what the force was
 
spud1897 said:
I'm sure I read somewhere that the reference to the second Shenmue tree was a mis-translation. I'll dig around

EDIT: Got it: https://www.shenmuedojo.com/forum/index.php?threads/random-shenmue-iii-thoughts.23/post-99509
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I sort of said this already a few posts later in that thread, but that's not the kind of mistake anyone who could translate just about anything from Japanese would make. "Big," and "tree" are two of the first characters anyone learning Japanese would pick up, and I don't think anyone who could read "Shenmue" would ever presume to see it where it wasn't written. Any possible way it would be written would be unmistakable from "a big tree," and the translator knew that, because both "big" and "tree" made it into the translation as well. In other words, I'm almost entirely certain that it's not an error. It's the kind of decision a translator would make after consulting with the original author(s) in order to make something more clear for a specific audience.

I actually wanted to check that notebook entry for the languages other than English and Japanese, and from what I could tell, every one of them (aside from "Chinese" (Mandarin and Cantonese, I assume)) seems to describe it as 'the (big) Shenmue (tree).' Likely the only way that happens is if it's an instruction to the translators. I suppose another possible scenario is that those other languages were translated from the English translation, but again, I don't think anyone who could even "poorly" translate this game could add "Shenmue" in error.


Also, as @Lan Di-sama articulated there, Shenmue II already heavily calls into question the idea of "Shenmue" being a single tree.

Part of me hates writing all this, because I think a fair number of people have really built up this assumption for themselves that Shenmue is a single tree, and it holds a very singular meaning for them in that context. I honestly don't think there's much to support Shenmue not being a family of trees, though. It certainly wasn't ever established to be the case, at least.


Obligatory, 'the sword was always supposed to be a dagger,' btw.
 
Rydeen said:
I sort of said this already a few posts later in that thread, but that's not the kind of mistake anyone who could translate just about anything from Japanese would make. "Big," and "tree" are two of the first characters anyone learning Japanese would pick up, and I don't think anyone who could read "Shenmue" would ever presume to see it where it wasn't written. Any possible way it would be written would be unmistakable from "a big tree," and the translator knew that, because both "big" and "tree" made it into the translation as well. In other words, I'm almost entirely certain that it's not an error. It's the kind of decision a translator would make after consulting with the original author(s) in order to make something more clear for a specific audience.

I actually wanted to check that notebook entry for the languages other than English and Japanese, and from what I could tell, every one of them (aside from "Chinese" (Mandarin and Cantonese, I assume)) seems to describe it as 'the (big) Shenmue (tree).' Likely the only way that happens is if it's an instruction to the translators. I suppose another possible scenario is that those other languages were translated from the English translation, but again, I don't think anyone who could even "poorly" translate this game could add "Shenmue" in error.


Also, as @Lan Di-sama articulated there, Shenmue II already heavily calls into question the idea of "Shenmue" being a single tree.

Part of me hates writing all this, because I think a fair number of people have really built up this assumption for themselves that Shenmue is a single tree, and it holds a very singular meaning for them in that context. I honestly don't think there's much to support Shenmue not being a family of trees, though. It certainly wasn't ever established to be the case, at least.


Obligatory, 'the sword was always supposed to be a dagger,' btw.
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I've always run on the assumption there must be more than one. Given the flashback in two which I'm assuming isn't anywhere close to Bailu. Its implied that Shenhua's family history is away from Bailu and that she's /her family ended up there. Could the trees be linked?? Quite possibly .

Yes agree re sword of seven stars. Even Yu Suzuki commented in an interview it was supposed to be a dagger in 2 but it was made too big and they didn't correct it until Shenmue III
 
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