SuperEyePatchWolf: "Shenmue III is a terrible game and I've wasted my life"

[GhostTrick]

But they're not in the same position. Shenhua has turned away a bit, Ryo has moved, they're closer together. Oh and not holding torches

They're doing nearly the same pose from a scene that supposedly happened a long moment ago. Of course they dont have the torches anymore. But the transition just looks bad. Time happened between those two scenes and yet it feels like the transition implies just a few seconds later.

 

[ShenSun]

Lol

Im going to lunch. You lot have fun

 

[GhostTrick]

No point in repeating a conversation that happened before anyway.
If some people are fine with that kind of cutscene quality, good on them.

It's also fine if people aren't fine with that kind of cutscene quality, when 20 years happened and that amateurs on SFM do a better job.

 

[spud1897]

They're doing nearly the same pose from a scene that supposedly happened a long moment ago. Of course they dont have the torches anymore. But the transition just looks bad. Time happened between those two scenes and yet it feels like the transition implies just a few seconds later.

So it's gone from exact to nearly .

I can't see how it implies anything than that they left the cave and went to the village. Now could they have done a little snippet/loading screen to say next day or whatever to help new players? Maybe. But it's hardly the issue you're making it out to be.

I thought it was pretty obvious. They did the cave thing, left, headed to the village, which is where the game picked up.

 

[spud1897]

No point in repeating a conversation that happened before anyway.
If some people are fine with that kind of cutscene quality, good on them.

It's also fine if people aren't fine with that kind of cutscene quality, when 20 years happened and that amateurs on SFM do a better job.

Stop with the amateur remark now. You've made your point and its boardering on disrespectful

 

[GhostTrick]

So it's gone from exact to nearly .

I can't see how it implies anything than that they left the cave and went to the village. Now could they have done a little snippet/loading screen to say next day or whatever to help new players? Maybe. But it's hardly the issue you're making it out to be.

I thought it was pretty obvious. They did the cave thing, left, headed to the village, which is where the game picked up.

Where did I say it implies something else ? I think we all understood what they were going for:
They left the cave and are heading to the village.
But if it was done well (it's not) the cutscene where they're heading to the village wouldn't start with Shenhua and Ryo facing with any context in the same position as the previous scene but walking directly toward the village.

 

[spud1897]

Where did I say it implies something else ? I think we all understood what they were going for:
They left the cave and are heading to the village.
But if it was done well (it's not) the cutscene where they're heading to the village wouldn't start with Shenhua and Ryo facing with any context in the same position as the previous scene but walking directly toward the village.

In your opinion it's not. Maybe I've missed something but aside from the fade to blacks, which I agree are odd, I've not seen anyone particularly fussed about the cave transition here.

 

[GhostTrick]

Stop with the amateur remark now. You've made your point and its boardering on disrespectful

I mean no disrespect toward amateurs. They often do a good job and with their own means. :)

 

[spud1897]

I mean no disrespect toward amateurs. They often do a good job and with their own means. :)

And that sarcastic smart-ass stuff stops as well.

 

[LemonHaze]

Where did I say it implies something else ? I think we all understood what they were going for:
They left the cave and are heading to the village.
But if it was done well (it's not) the cutscene where they're heading to the village wouldn't start with Shenhua and Ryo facing with any context in the same position as the previous scene but walking directly toward the village.

To be fair, you did say " move to the new location while holding the same position " and now it's " They're doing nearly the same pose from a scene that supposedly happened a long moment ago. ". But regardless, I don't really see the issue, if you understood the purpose of the cut as you said to me before that you did, then I think you'd probably see that this fading 'issue' you're talking about is basically a non-issue, the cut is literally just to avoid from watching Ryo & Shenhua actually leaving the cave to be honest.... so it cuts to them being in Bailu, I'm really not understanding the huge cinematography error which has occured.

 

[GhostTrick]

And that sarcastic smart-ass stuff stops as well.

I would appreciate if that worked in both ways.

 

[spud1897]

I would appreciate if that worked in both ways.

There's a difference, your consistent tone around here is as described when someone debates something with you and resort to it when someone makes a point that you don't really a leg to stand on.

Example. You said exact, I said nearly ( a little tongue in cheek admittedly). All the while you've been brandishing around the amateur remark which I asked you politely to drop. I'm then responded to with a remark that again is just a backhanded way of making your point, so yeah it's being a smart-ass but not in the funny sense.

So it's simple drop the attitude.

 

[WuyingRen]

the cutscene where they're heading to the village wouldn't start with Shenhua and Ryo facing with any context in the same position as the previous scene but walking directly toward the village.

You’re right. Why on earth would two people who are having a conversation be facing one another? Shenhua should clearly be gazing out across the vista while Ryo takes a sneaky peek at her breasts.

 

[ShenSun]

I mean no disrespect toward amateurs. They often do a good job and with their own means. :)

Why are you always moaning? Odd thing is i agree with alot of the points you raise, but man, the constant moaning, hand waving and snarky attitude is on another level. Just be cool man. You'll get along with alot more people that way.

 

[Suzaku]

View attachment 8527

You guys are insane.

This is epic ahahahah

 

[ShenSun]

This is epic ahahahah

Nominating @tomboz and @Revan for post of the thread. Spat my tea out reading their comments. Very funny dudes

 

[mjqjazzbar]

I’m as guilty as anyone of complaining about stuff, but I think it's safe to assume Ys Net won’t make their cutscenes with random fades to black if anyone from the team attempts to endure 30 pages of this thread.

 

[WuyingRen]

I mean no disrespect toward amateurs. They often do a good job and with their own means. :)

You know I’d planned on just continuing to ignore your nonsense as I learned quite some time ago that trying to engage in reasoned conversation with you was a waste of time, but in the interest of saving the time of some of the other posters here who haven’t learned that lesson yet...

For somebody who seems to think of themselves as some sort of cinematography expert, your knowledge of modern day film-making techniques really does leave a lot to be desired.

The transition in the scene in question is what’s known as a match cut (a graphic match, if you want to be specific) and is an incredibly commonly used technique across pretty much all visual mediums.

You can argue all you like that it’s poorly executed or that a match cut wasn’t the best choice for this transition (personally, I think it worked quite nicely), but to suggest that it’s some bizarre editing blunder made by amateurs demonstrates a clear lack of understanding of what I’d consider to be very basic editing techniques.

And before you think about coming back with claims that you of course know what a match cut is, please save us all the time.

You see, it’s comments like this one...

Time happened between those two scenes and yet it feels like the transition implies just a few seconds later.

... that give you away.

Match cuts can be used to transition between both short and long passages of time, but they are typically one of the go-to techniques when a filmmaker wants to jump many years ahead or backwards in time (as you can see here, here and here), so I’m not sure how you could possibly argue that the use of a match cut implies that only a few seconds have passed.

We don’t just use match cuts to transition between different periods of time either, with them often being used to take the viewer from one location to another without having to resort to fades and hard cuts - as we see in the opening moments of Shenmue 3.

And just in case you want to try and argue that match cuts are something that we only see in movies, here is a nice example of a match cut (albeit a slightly different type) from GTA IV, which I'm fairly certain was not directed by amateurs.

Rather than spending your time constantly trying to tear people down, perhaps consider taking a moment to educate yourself instead.

 

[iknifaugood]

Agreed, as evidenced by the fact that even when trying to cut out as much of Shenmue 2's none-essential story as possible, I mentioned Xiuying as she is absolutely essential to Shenmue 2's narrative. Her giving Ryo the pendant though? Assuming it ends up being important at all (to be clear, I do think it will), when and where she gives this to Ryo is pretty inconsequential.

True, it’s not that the pendant is in an of itself important, more that if you were to summarize the entire Shenmue story, you wouldn’t be able to leave that out depending on how it’s used. Like if Ryo loses a fight to Ziming (keeping in his tradition of losing every major fight at least once) and Ziming only spares his life because of the pendant or something like that, you would need to know how Ryo obtained it.

Agreed, but one could argue that we saw plenty of poor story-telling in Shenmue 3 - so if one subscribes to that argument, it should be entirely possible that this could continue into future games. Plus there's the matter of budget. If Yu has to cut the four leaders story-line in order to wrap everything up in a single game, who is to say that Zimming won't be cut along with it (I know that Yu has stated that Zimming is not one of the four leaders, but I'd always envisaged him being introduced as part of this wider plot)?

Very true, which is why I don’t fault anyone for being pessimistic about the future of Shenmue’s storyline. I will say that it would be far more disappointing to lose Ziming (a character that has been introduced) rather than the four leaders, which only exist as a pre-production concept (cool though it may be).

I can agree with this to an extent, but feel like the narrative threads established earlier in the series make it very difficult for Yu to speed up Ryo's arc too much as there is simply too much that needs to happen before the story is ready for a properly adjusted Ryo. I also feel as though the events that trigger Ryo's 'moment of realization' are precluded by other events that simply can't happen at this point in the story.

Ultimately I have no issue with the change to Ryo's mindset taking time as I have experienced this kind of stubborn determination in my life (both in myself and in those around me) and am well aware that these things can often take time (assuming that is, that the person ever changes). That Ryo's mindset hasn't changed doesn't mean that his character arc hasn't progressed though nor does it negate the things that he experienced throughout the course of Shenmue 3.

I don’t mind it either. I like Shenmue primarily because of how grand it’s aspirations are, I like that it was shooting for the moon, trying to tell this epic story and I really like how S2 expanded the scope of the world. Ryo traveling across China, learning from different masters, following the footsteps of his father, discovering the mysteries of the mirrors and his destiny, that’s all good stuff that can distract from a simpler character. The problem is that S3 contains so little of the “epic” stuff and many people on these forums seem to think that S3 is some brilliant character study; in which case I think Ryo’s character is far too shallow to sustain that kind of narrative. If S3 was the story of Ryo’s personal growth then I didn’t see much growth take place.

I agree with this (especially the example that you gave, which I think is quite likely), but not the way that SEPW presents the argument at the end of his video

Truthfully his argument gets kind of muddled for me at the end of the video, like he’s trying to lay the blame on Suzuki without actually saying it. Like is his point really that Suzuki is trying to reclaim his past glories by rebooting Shenmue for a new age? He’s arguing that Suzuki is stuck in the past but also that he changed Shenmue for the worse. Pick a lane.

 

[iknifaugood]

You really deserve a prize for this. Not just for the excellent analysis, but also for the incredible patience displayed in trying to carry a conversation with someone who repeatedly shifts arguments in order to avoid any sort of concession.

Weren’t you trying to argue that S3’s combat is as fully featured and S1 and 2’s, minus the throws? Pots and kettles.