Would you take a 'dumbed-down' Shenmue 4 over the alternative?

Suiryuu said:
This is such a funny post, you clearly think that the third option is the best and everyone is excited for the first. I'm excited for the first as well, and I hope that's what Shenmue 4 ends up being (new music, obviously, but reused assets could go super far in other areas).
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I'd take any playable option over a book or a movie, but if Option 1 is it, which it probably will be, then I hope the gameplay focus shifts away from gambling & repetition to something more illuminating to the Shenmue story a s a whole. I consider it 'dumbed down' in the sense that they'd reduce interactivity and focus on moving the story forward, but use the same engine and assets as in Shenmue 3.
 
Option 1 clearly. I am of the steadfast belief that Shenmue IV will be a lot cheaper to make than III.

Although when Shenmue IV does get released, no doubt people would moan about it anyway :p
 
mjqjazzbar said:
1. Shenmue assets, music and gameplay from Shenmue 3 to tell the remainder of the Shenmue story. There might be a tweak here or there, but you're gonna turn it on and know you're playing not much more than an expansion of Shenmue 3
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This is most likely. They have the assets, the engine, and the pipeline knowledge, it would be very expensive to change this format unless they could somehow be guaranteed more money.

mjqjazzbar said:
2. Telltale Shenmue. Decrease most interactivity and now Shenmue is essentially a visual novel with some light gameplay touches. Combat is a nonstarter.
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Extremely unlikely. Telltale games are about as popular as Shenmue and are expensive to produce with an emphasis on cutscenes, writing and voice acting. It's essentially getting all the headaches of making a CGI movie with most of the headaches of making a game and very little guarantee of a big payday.

mjqjazzbar said:
3. Change the genre entirely. Hire a competent studio to make a brawler with quality cutscenes, but with gameplay that mostly focuses mostly on combat. We're four games into the series now; shouldn't action take precedent over investigation anyway? Give Shenmue the Spikeout or Streets of Rage 4 treatment and see what happens; you'll probably pick up a few casuals along the way. I'm sure these games cost way more to develop than I could ever imagine, so maybe it's a nonstarter... Maybe the Battle Rally engine could be tweaked a bit? Sega has so many talented companies to out-source their franchises to these days....
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This is more of a jarring tonal shift than anything else. Shenmue has fighting but its never really been a brawler. Plus, this would require them to abandon a lot of the exploration systems (examining items, playing mini games, dialogue etc.) in favor of the combat system and, frankly, S3's combat system needs massive retooling to be able to carry an entire game.

This is an interesting question, if these are my only choices I would probably take option 1 unless there was a really great dev behind the combat and cutscenes, in which case I'd take 3.

IMO Shenmue should adopt a simpler JRPG style like Persona (so less complex minigames and interactions) and a greater emphasis on combat with a well-designed combat system. Wrap this up in a compelling story that moves at the pace of S2 and I think it would have broad(er) appeal. But as I said, it'll be hard/impossible to shift gears like that at this point.
 
Option 1 only. Options 2 and 3 are a absolute No go for me.

I like Shenmue mostly for the interactivity and not so much for the Story. Options 2 and 3 would kill the interactivity so it is a no go for me.
 
I don't think I could settle for Shenmue IV as a brawler... I mean think of how little combat Shenmue 1 has, it's actually a very minor aspect to the overall experience - if anything I think the combat/training is something the series needs to improve. Shenmue 3 did well in having dojos to train your moves but you could cheat that by just spamming the same move over and over as the more you use it the more the move exp goes up.
 
To be quite honest I would of been happy with the whole series being presented on Dreamcast if it would of sold. As long as it keeps the essence of the first two games (I have not played the third) I am good. And don't do exclusivity again! They already shot off one foot and hopping around now. They will be in a wheel chair next time.

Shenmue has always been about a pick up and play game. It had a little bit of everything. Kind of like Zelda or Mario. Almost anyone can play it and enjoy it. To me it was a mix of adventure, fighting/brawler, point and click and QTE's, accompanied by great visuals (I still love the Dreamcast graphics), great aesthetics, great music, great atmosphere, a feeling of needing to continue (Still sad we left Japan though as that is my place of choice) and the list goes on. To take away what has made Shenmue "Shenmue" would seem detrimental and not a Shenmue game at all.

Then we would end up with Yakuza, which in it's own right is a good game, but not Shenmue. Another example would be Morrowind to Final Fantasy 7. Two really good games, but one no where near like the other. If I buy a Shenmue game I want it to feel and play like Shenmue, not like something else.
 
Vivi-gamer said:
I don't think I could settle for Shenmue IV as a brawler... I mean think of how little combat Shenmue 1 has, it's actually a very minor aspect to the overall experience - if anything I think the combat/training is something the series needs to improve. Shenmue 3 did well in having dojos to train your moves but you could cheat that by just spamming the same move over and over as the more you use it the more the move exp goes up.
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They did not lock the level until you revisited a dojo again? Like you can gain levels or up until the next level, but then it just does not pass over until you are judged by the dojo sensei or what ever?
 
I'd say option 1, 3, then 2 for me.

If you remix the assets, I probably wouldn't be able to tell the difference. Even if they were the exact same without them doing anything new to them, I'd still be cool if it meant the traditional Shenmue experience.

I'm fine with an increase on combat focus, it makes sense as the stakes are being raised in the narrative, but the combat would have to be on par with the 1st 2 games. I'm not cool with them cutting any of the detective experience to streamline the game though.

A movie game would be my least preferred way to end it, but if it had to come to that, oh well.

My ideal experience would be something between 1 & 3. A bit more combat focus, same detective gameplay, with a bit of common sense quality of life additions here and there.
 
Toua77 said:
A movie game would be my least preferred way to end it, but if it had to come to that, oh well.
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That is how they caught up the Original XBOX players from the first game on the second game. You watched, what I assume, were all the cut scenes from the first game. Personally they should of just included the first game with the second one. I think it would of been much better received.
 
Personally, I think telltale games and walking simulators are neither good movies nor good games, both aspects restricting each other's potential. They sound good in theory, but just make me want to play an actual game or watch an actual movie, always leaving me disappointed. I also can't see Yu Suzuki going with this option either. It's such a step down from what we've had.

My completely unsubstantiated guess is he wants a fully interactive game comparable to the previous 3 or a completely different media altogether (i.e. manga or anime) and i'd be all for that.
 
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Keep the exploration factor and story telling, cut out entirely the mini games, forklifts and casino style fluff, especially this far into Ryos journey. He isn't back in Japan going to the arcade living his daily life, things are heating up now. The fighting is whatever, it's never been the main focus or highlight of Shenmue so if a little can be left in(boss fights, Lan Di, etc)then that's cool, otherwise it plays like some crap game like Virtua Fighter so it's not at the top of the list. Use Shenmue 1 2 and 3 graphics, textures, mechanics, etc. I don't want to see anymore Shenmue games refined graphically, the 3rd one looked like a nice refresh of the originals. It has a unique beauty, no need for cutting edge. If needed, get rid of Japanese voice actors and keep English ones. Make the game 100% digital only to cut down production costs. Keep it far far far away from the Yakuza team!

If for some reason the story cannot be finished in true Shenmue game form or the only other desperate alternative(though much lesser) a video game movie with the graphics of Shenmue but little to no game play then I'd rather just have a video interview with Yu Suzuki telling us the rest of the plot and how it ends, possibly showing us some of the script if needed before having manga, anime, comics or any other medium.
 
Option 1 sounds reasonable to me.

I do not want Shenmue to become Yakuza. I LOVE Yakuza. But that's not why I love Shenmue. They are different things and I want them to remain as different things. The fights in Shenmue are few and far between but are always there to serve the story and I think that's what I like about it. I want that to remain for Shenmue.

All I want from Shenmue IV is a more focused story that takes further cues from Shenmue II. And given where the plot is going, I actually do think IV will resemble more of II. III resembled the first game in the sense that it was the getting to know you chapter with regards to Shenhua. IV is setting up further confrontation and I think it should take its cues from Shenmue II in that regard.

I think IV is the game that will finally delve into the Chi You Men. That's what the end of III was setting up as our trio head for further conflict.

That's really all I want from Shenmue IV. Something that is closer to Shenmue II in terms of pacing and plot. I liked SIII and the time spent in Bailu was reminiscent of the time spent in Yokosuka. But IV is time for plot progression and I do feel that is what it was setting up come the end of IV. So give me something that is more reminicesent of the best parts of Shenmue II.

I think IV could get away with being a little more action oriented. Especially given the seeds are all now in place. We now know Ryo, We now know Shenhua. We have established Ren's character. So yeah, give me something that is closer to the best parts of Shenmue II while still retaining the Shenmue spirit.
 
Sadly, yes. If "dumbed down" in this case means "faster-paced and less meandering", while I love those calmer parts of Ryo's journey to enlightenment, if the entire story is going to be full of idiotic things such as the stupid body slam move subplot, (Which develops Ryo's character in a cheap way, while conveniently ignoring any chances to elaborate more on his father's backstory despite the VERY likely chance father and son trained under the same man), then the story will lose nothing by just getting to the point.

IMHO the scene where Lan Di beats Ryo into a pulp should've been the half-way point to a game about the truth of the Phoenix Mirror, possibly ending with Ren betraying and leaving him to die (I am convinced this is where the story is going), setting the stage for the next game.

But instead, we get filler. And important plot stuff shoved aside for more filler. Filler filler filler. Screw that, either the filler has to mean something, as it did in Shenmue 1, or it needs to build up the plot. S3 did neither.

So. I wouldn't be against S4 skipping over the more uninteresting locations (over their place in the story, or just them as sandbox sections) to get to the actual story. I wanna see Ryo battle the Chi You Men HEAD ON on top of the cliff temple and then find a secret vault that unveils an AWFUL secret about the mirrors. It'd be so epic.
 
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