Did the original Shenmue III that was suppose to release in 2003 had more story?

[ahmed_alency7]

My question is did the original Shenmue lll that was suppose to come out in 2003 had more story. One time Yu Suzuki was showing fans that he was even able to achieve the concepts and story elements he had originally planned & he also said he's created a bigger and better Shenmue 3 than what was originally envisioned does he mean what he envisioned during the Kickstarter or after Shenmue ll's development was done around 2001-2003?

 

[orient]

We don't know much of anything about this theoretical 2003 Shenmue III. I haven't seen any concrete evidence to suggest it was worked on past the earliest stages of preproduction, so my initial answer would be, "No, because they never got that far".

I think they had a rough outline of S3 from back in the day, which was then used to create a more detailed game design when the Kickstarter was successful. Then, based on production realities, during development they had to cut certain parts to get it out the door (Baisha).

So I do think there was more story planned, but I think it was cut from the 2015-16 version of S3, not from a 2003 version, but that's just me

 

[ahmed_alency7]

We don't know much of anything about this theoretical 2003 Shenmue III. I haven't seen any concrete evidence to suggest it was worked on past the earliest stages of preproduction, so my initial answer would be, "No, because they never got that far".

I think they had a rough outline of S3 from back in the day, which was then used to create a more detailed game design when the Kickstarter was successful. Then, based on production realities, during development they had to cut certain parts to get it out the door (Baisha).

So I do think there was more story planned, but I think it was cut from the 2015-16 version of S3, not from a 2003 version, but that's just me I think it wasn't cut to get it out cause in return all the gameplay implements that were suppose to be in Baisha were in Niaowu and Niaowu was expanded more than originally intended.

 

[9dragons]

It is impossible to really answer that question. We do not even know if Shenmue 3 was seriously consididered in the early 2000s at all. Shenmue 2 was realeased in 2001. Arround that time Sega was clinically dead already. They were fighting for survial and offed the Dreamcast prematurely in order to do so. I seriously doubt that would be willing to spend any resources for a part 3 of not sucessful game. Would Shenmue 3 be a different game around tha time when Yu had all the resources from the old Sega campared to the Kickstarter game? Very likely but only Yu-San knows for sure and he has not told us yet.

Around the time Shenmue 3 was nothing more than pipe dream. A concept at best. Nothing was certain yet.

 

[ahmed_alency7]

It is impossible to really answer that question. We do not even know if Shenmue 3 was seriously consididered in the early 2000s at all. Shenmue 2 was realeased in 2001. Arround that time Sega was clinically dead already. They were fighting for survial and offed the Dreamcast prematurely in order to do so. I seriously doubt that would be willing to spend any resources for a part 3 of not sucessful game. Would Shenmue 3 be a different game around tha time when Yu had all the resources from the old Sega campared to the Kickstarter game? Very likely but only Yu-San knows for sure and he has not told us yet.

Around the time Shenmue 3 was nothing more than pipe dream. A concept at best. Nothing was certain yet.

Thank you for the answer please check my switch thread do you think Sega is holding them from cing cause we already have the anime?

 

[orient]

I think it wasn't cut to get it out cause in return all the gameplay implements that were suppose to be in Baisha were in Niaowu and Niaowu was expanded more than originally intended.

All of the daily activities and side quests made it over to Niaowu, probably, but there were other gameplay systems planned (that must have tied in with the story) that were cut, such as the "character perspective system" and the "warring factions" gameplay, both outlined in the game's Kickstarter campaign.

Just to clarify, I don't think we missed out on any huge moments in the story. I think S3 had all the big moments, but they cut the "in between" stuff, set-up that would've made the ending feel a lot more satisfying, for example. They didn't have the budget to flesh out the side characters in the same way, either.

 

[ahmed_alency7]

All of the daily activities and side quests made it over to Niaowu, probably, but there were other gameplay systems planned (that must have tied in with the story) that were cut, such as the "character perspective system" and the "warring factions" gameplay, both outlined in the game's Kickstarter campaign.

Just to clarify, I don't think we missed out on any huge moments in the story. I think S3 had all the big moments, but they cut the "in between" stuff, set-up that would've made the ending feel a lot more satisfying, for example. They didn't have the budget to flesh out the side characters in the same way, either.

Do you think they used up all they can or do you think they could've cut more deals to add to the budget?

 

[RyoHazuki84]

I'll admit it's hard to say, but the concept was for the game to develop inwardly as opposed to outwardly, and I felt we got that with the Shenmue III we got. I'll admit some things would've been different if Shenmue III came out on Japanese Dreamcast in 2003. I say certain characters' roles would've played out differently, etc. There is so much that would've been different, but I think the story would've been the same, but I'm wondering if the execution would've been different.

 

[ys.]

It is impossible to really answer that question. We do not even know if Shenmue 3 was seriously consididered in the early 2000s at all. Shenmue 2 was realeased in 2001. Arround that time Sega was clinically dead already. They were fighting for survial and offed the Dreamcast prematurely in order to do so. I seriously doubt that would be willing to spend any resources for a part 3 of not sucessful game. Would Shenmue 3 be a different game around tha time when Yu had all the resources from the old Sega campared to the Kickstarter game? Very likely but only Yu-San knows for sure and he has not told us yet.

Around the time Shenmue 3 was nothing more than pipe dream. A concept at best. Nothing was certain yet.

I don't know if the game back then would have had more story but I suspect that it might have been more streamlined and structured like the first two with more cutscenes.

It's possible though that they considered making Shenmue 3 around that time.

Shenmue III for the X? - IGN

The lead for Shenmue II says more Ryo Hazuki adventures are on the way.

www.ign.com

They refer to this interview with Shin Ishikawa : https://www.the-nextlevel.com/features/interviews/am2/

It seems as if they at least intended to continue if possible and he mentions that the story would expand enormously. I also remember another article from back then on IGN but can't find it now. I seem to remember that it was also Ishikawa who apologized that it took long to release Shenmue 2 and said that we wouldn't have to wait as long for Shenmue 3.

 

[9dragons]

I see. Thanks for telling me. I did not know that to be honest that there was at least a slight chance for another Shenmue in 2003 for the Xbox. That is really interesting. To bad it did not work out.

 

[ys.]

No problem, I thought of that while I was reading the thread. It's interesting though that he talks about the story expanding enormously. I wonder how he meant that exactly? Yu Suzuki often talked about the story getting more internal in Shenmue 3. Maybe Ishikawa literally meant expanding when it comes to locations?
And yeah, it's too bad that it did not work out then. This also made me think about the (controversial) Kikizo article from 2005 now : http://archive.videogamesdaily.com/news/200508/141_p1.asp

 

[Spaghetti]

So I do think there was more story planned, but I think it was cut from the 2015-16 version of S3, not from a 2003 version, but that's just me

This is the reality, though I feel it might go beyond even what was cut out of the Shenmue III alpha build, based on a few things uncovered in the finished game's data like unused lines, a whole aborted DLC, etc. The biggest secrets were undoubtedly dummied out, but even what was left is surprising.

 

[ahmed_alency7]

This is the reality, though I feel it might go beyond even what was cut out of the Shenmue III alpha build, based on a few things uncovered in the finished game's data like unused lines, a whole aborted DLC, etc. The biggest secrets were undoubtedly dummied out, but even what was left is surprising.

What's the aborted DLC?

 

[spud1897]

What's the aborted DLC?

https://www.shenmuedojo.com/forum/index.php?threads/shenmusings-my-shenmue-blog-updated-26-08-2021-shenmue-iii-unused-dialogue-ren-playable-in-bailu.215/#post-124071

 

[danielmann861]

I don't know. I honestly think we would have gotten as much as we did in current day SIII. But again, that's hard to say considering Baisha was cut and who knows how much story Baisha was supposed to have? Was the first confrontation between Ryo and Lan Di supposed to happen in Baisha? Or was it always planned to happen in Niaowu with Baisha being the follow up? The whole warring factions thing makes me think Baisha would have taken place after the events in Niaowu and maybe it would be a fight to regain possession of the mirrors. Which makes me wonder, would we have gone from Baisha to the climb across the great wall of China on the way to the temple.

But in general, I do wonder how much of this story has been altered from its original grand vision over the years in general? I tend to think though, given the formula of Shenmue, we probably would have gotten the same back then as we got now.

I would still just love to see it in its original form with no compromises made whatsoever.

But again, hard to say. Back then we would have had different writers writing it and maybe it would have been fleshed out more? In terms of major story points? I still think it would have been much the same though. Ryo looking for someone. Ryo being trained along the way. Ryo chasing the breadcrumbs towards Lan Di. That's been the formula these games have generally adhered to. But maybe the writing would have been better with the original writers on hand? They have the major plot points but no much else, right? So consider the major plot points of SIII and yeah, it probably would have been the same.

Lan Di and Ryo fight their first match. Ryo loses. Chi You Men now have mirrors in their possession. Story continues.

But the delivery is what may have been different back then.

 

[mjqjazzbar]

I think the original Shenmue III would've been as "well written" as the first two games, and in that sense I do think we would've experienced more plot development or much fuller scenarios. I definitely think Bailu would've limited/lacked all the mini games/fun fair element, which would've been a huge benefit to my enjoyment, but I think I understand why it ended up in the current game (makes the game more accessible to people who are just starting Shenmue but don't realize just how SLOW PACED the story is gonna get in Bailu, which we were all expecting at the end of Shenmue II). I think the general "beats" would've been similar, though I struggle to believe "Generic Tough 1" and "Generic Tough 2" would've made it to the final game. We would've at least had more scenes where you can learn about their motivations. It looks like others have touched on that point: the plot/story/charactes would have been more FLESHED OUT, but not necessarily different.

 

[xatruio]

I think the original Shenmue III would've been as "well written" as the first two games, and in that sense I do think we would've experienced more plot development or much fuller scenarios. I definitely think Bailu would've limited/lacked all the mini games/fun fair element, which would've been a huge benefit to my enjoyment, but I think I understand why it ended up in the current game (makes the game more accessible to people who are just starting Shenmue but don't realize just how SLOW PACED the story is gonna get in Bailu, which we were all expecting at the end of Shenmue II). I think the general "beats" would've been similar, though I struggle to believe "Generic Tough 1" and "Generic Tough 2" would've made it to the final game. We would've at least had more scenes where you can learn about their motivations. It looks like others have touched on that point: the plot/story/charactes would have been more FLESHED OUT, but not necessarily different.

Regrettably, you're describing the inherent sacrifices required for kickstarters--regardless of AA publisher coming along (then rushing the end)

 

[danielmann861]

Another thought occurred on this.

Let’s say Shenmue IIx had been a success and we got Shenmue III on the Xbox. Would AM2 have actually kept building on top of what they already had? Or would the game have taken on a new engine of sorts? According to Ryan Payton, we know YSnet spent most of their time rebuilding systems from scratch in Unreal with Shenmue III. Would the same thing have happened with IIIx if it had been a thing back in the day? Or would they have theoretically kept building on top of what they already had with IIx?

I imagine if the Xbox version had been a success, they would have eventually had to transition from the Dreamcast code to something built around getting the most out of the Xbox, right?

Would that have effected a theoretical Shenmue IIIx?

 

[JCJ]

Another thought occurred on this.

Let’s say Shenmue IIx had been a success and we got Shenmue III on the Xbox. Would AM2 have actually kept building on top of what they already had? Or would the game have taken on a new engine of sorts? According to Ryan Payton, we know YSnet spent most of their time rebuilding systems from scratch in Unreal with Shenmue III. Would the same thing have happened with IIIx if it had been a thing back in the day? Or would they have theoretically kept building on top of what they already had with IIx?

I imagine if the Xbox version had been a success, they would have eventually had to transition from the Dreamcast code to something built around getting the most out of the Xbox, right?

Would that have effected a theoretical Shenmue IIIx?

That's an interesting question.

Coming from such a high pedigree studio as AM2, Shenmue IIx was a bit disappointing because it still looked like a slightly improved Dreamcast game, and was really far from the best looking games on the Xbox.

A good reference of what AM2 could achieve from scratch with Xbox hardware was the Outrun 2 arcade game. And I'd bet a Shenmue III on Xbox would have been at least at that level.

 

[RyoHazuki84]

Was AM2 in charge of the XBox port?