IGN Reporting Bugs - Dojo cited.

Jibby said:
We're all passionate people and I think we've got our own ways of expressing that.
Just please keep it civil and respectful when discussing things; be they positive or negative. That's all we ask.

If you spot something that isn't one of these things (from either side of the debate), we implore you to please use the report button so we can look into it.
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will do...
 
Man, so much vitriol being thrown about these days.

I'm of the mindset that there was a..misunderstanding afoot. D3T was given a project of immense scale(porting from 20 year old source code) and very little time to do so by SEGA Europe.

I don't think they recieved a lot of help, either. They took pride in what they were able to accomplish and that's fine.

SEGA Japan took notice of its success(via pre-orders, sales, etc.) and also realized the passion for this game. They came to the conclusion the work done, while respectable, was not satisfactory for this series.

Count the blessings, honestly. Does it suck that we got a rushed project? Yes, but let's be real--

*Very* few publishers or developers would be willing to step in, acknowledge a substandard release and take steps to fix it thoroughly, especially for a remaster of games that are 20 years old.

It really says a lot that they brought someone in, a veteran, specifically for that purpose.

That shows me that Shenmue has been recognized by them as a prized IP, whereas once it was feared lost to the distant whispers of past time.


The story of Shenmue's resurrection and integration into a new generation of people who now enjoy it is nothing short of miraculous. There is hardly anything, in any medium, that can say that they've done such a thing for an old property on this scale.
 
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I just can't shake off this feeling like the IGN Article is tryin to keep fanning the flame of a slowly fading shenmue controversy...I mean it's been more than a month already IGN couldn't reach out to SEGAJP and get this statement till now? It felt like IGN only cared about it now cuz they can get an easy article out of it.:cautious:
 
I'm not one of the people who's super upset about things, and I'm definitely no fan of IGN, but I thought the article is fair and also informative. I think the timing of it is simply related to the presentation at TGS.
 
ι«˜ι‡Žε’Œζ³‰ said:
I just can't shake off this feeling like the IGN Article is tryin to keep fanning the flame of a slowly fading shenmue controversy...I mean it's been more than a month already IGN couldn't reach out to SEGAJP and get this statement till now? It felt like IGN only cared about it now cuz they can get an easy article out of it.:cautious:
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Basically it's what journalists do, find a story that think will get attention and write it, and there's not much in gaming journalism more than PR moves.
Would it be different if they made it 3 weeks ago ?
The people here were still saying "day 1 patch" like parrots, and everyone else that didn't echo the same thing were handwaved.
If it were done after the game was fully patched, ok, I'd say it was a late attempt to dogpile and cash on previous "controversy", but not even that.

The game now (I guess, haven't really played since patch 2 on pc), is quite playable despite some sounds effects, but to be honest, if I was playing the game for the first time and payed 30 bucks for a game that would ruin cutscenes (in a story based game), I would be pretty pissed off.
 
I don't know if it's fair to say D3T didn't have a lot of time. Development started in 2015, according to the PC Gamer article. Is three years a fair amount of time for a port, albeit a massive one? I honestly don't know the answer.

Not trying to get mixed up in forum drama as much anymore. The culture around here has changed. I find myself wanting to reply to posts, but thinking better of it and just walking away. :hmm:
 
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Peter said:
This has gotten way off the original topic of the IGN report. If it's not back on topic sharpish, this is locked.
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Where then, may we discuss how this forum's team has very deliberately attempted to control the forum's reception of these ports?

I've been a member of the dojo for 9 years and still hesitated following to the new domain under your ownership. I hope many others abandon ship with me after seeing your leadership in action.
 
AnimeGamer183 said:
Lets talk about the importance of this article and the bugs finally getting main stream coverage and how this is going to force the hands that be
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Valascaziel said:
Man, so much vitriol being thrown about these days.

I'm of the mindset that there was a..misunderstanding afoot. D3T was given a project of immense scale(porting from 20 year old source code) and very little time to do so by SEGA Europe.

I don't think they recieved a lot of help, either. They took pride in what they were able to accomplish and that's fine.

SEGA Japan took notice of its success(via pre-orders, sales, etc.) and also realized the passion for this game. They came to the conclusion the work done, while respectable, was not satisfactory for this series.

Count the blessings, honestly. Does it suck that we got a rushed project? Yes, but let's be real--

*Very* few publishers or developers would be willing to step in, acknowledge a substandard release and take steps to fix it thoroughly, especially for a remaster of games that are 20 years old.

It really says a lot that they brought someone in, a veteran, specifically for that purpose.

That shows me that Shenmue has been recognized by them as a prized IP, whereas once it was feared lost to the distant whispers of past time.


The story of Shenmue's resurrection and integration into a new generation of people who now enjoy it is nothing short of miraculous. There is hardly anything, in any medium, that can say that they've done such a thing for an old property on this scale.
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This is exactly what I've been thinking.

I'm happy to admit the games came out in a rushed state but nothing will ruin the fact that we have Shenmue on modern formats. Remember the dark days from basically 2002 onwards, troll after troll on the internet and then one day the series came back with a massive bang.

The mainstream media will always pick on Shenmue though this article was a translation from one that IGN Japan did and they are a bit more favourable to the series.

Should these games have been rushed out? No but it was only after pre-orders looked good did Sega Japan really want to get involved. Sega Europe should have done better QA but I get the impression this was a pain to get greenlit and Japan wanted nothing to do with it initially.

This game breathes a passion for us like no other and we all want the best for it. That situation is coming and while it could have been better I'm grateful. Keep the pressure on reporting bugs but always remember the depths we have emerged from. And we did that as a community, together. This is the best community on the internet!
 
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staplepuffs27 said:
I don't know if it's fair to say D3T didn't have a lot of time. Development started in 2015, according to the PC Gamer article. Is three years a fair amount of time for a massive port, albeit a massive one? I honestly don't know the answer.
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It does seem like an extraordinary long amount of time.
On the other hand, the patches so far have demonstrated that delaying just a couple of months would have resulted in a dramatically better shipping product.

It's weird.

What do we know, though?
1. The source code provided to d3t was incomplete.
2. d3t were not provided with Dreamcast's libraries*.
3. d3t resorted to community tools and original Dreamcast/X-Box discs to obtain and organise certain assets (such as the speech and audio), implying that these were not simply handed to d3t.
4. Up until very recently (most likely post-launch), d3t were not offered consultation with any original Shenmue or Dreamcast staff.

We also know that the entire project has been spearheaded by Sega Europe, not Sega Japan, and that the latter chose a later release date than the former.

Everyone's free to make their own assumptions, but personally I don't think it's reasonable to blame d3t entirely, Sega Europe entirely, or Sega Japan entirely. I think a combination of the three, together with the fact that this was a difficult project to begin with (Dreamcast ports seem to be difficult in general) that led to the situation we have now.

*the full meaning and implication for this is unclear to me. I take it to mean that d3t had to reverse-engineer, rather than translate, API calls within the code. But I could well be wrong. One thing to keep in mind is that they clearly have had problems emulating the Dreamcast's sound processing chip. They appear to have basically "guessed" their way into things sounding sort of right, most of the time. I wonder if some official documentation for the Dreamcast's hardware would have helped.
 
catonkatonk said:
It does seem like an extraordinary long amount of time.
On the other hand, the patches so far have demonstrated that delaying just a couple of months would have resulted in a dramatically better shipping product.

It's weird.

What do we know, though?
1. The source code provided to d3t was incomplete.
2. d3t were not provided with Dreamcast's libraries*.
3. d3t resorted to community tools and original Dreamcast/X-Box discs to obtain and organise certain assets (such as the speech and audio), implying that these were not simply handed to d3t.
4. Up until very recently (most likely post-launch), d3t were not offered consultation with any original Shenmue or Dreamcast staff.

We also know that the entire project has been spearheaded by Sega Europe, not Sega Japan, and that the latter chose a later release date than the former.

Everyone's free to make their own assumptions, but personally I don't think it's reasonable to blame d3t entirely, Sega Europe entirely, or Sega Japan entirely. I think a combination of the three, together with the fact that this was a difficult project to begin with (Dreamcast ports seem to be difficult in general) that led to the situation we have now.

*the full meaning and implication for this is unclear to me. I take it to mean that d3t had to reverse-engineer, rather than translate, API calls within the code. But I could well be wrong. One thing to keep in mind is that they clearly have had problems emulating the Dreamcast's sound processing chip. They appear to have basically "guessed" their way into things sounding sort of right, most of the time. I wonder if some official documentation for the Dreamcast's hardware would have helped.
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Spoken with true sense. I do think Sega basically left them to get on with it with minimal help.

It's a shame as the patches prove with the right support and time that actually things could be and I'm sure will be excellent.

Had it shipped as the PC version is now I don't think some people would have been as damming about it all. Anyway onwards and upwards
 
mjqjazzbar said:
It seems like most people, particularly first timers, aren’t even aware there are any bugs. To me, that means the bug issue is currently overblown. The music in Shenmue 2? Yeah that’s fucked up. Otherwise, cmon.
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Did you even play these games! I'm getting bugs all the time. Anyone that's actually played through this would know that it's a mess. I think someone should take this company to court. It's unacceptable to release a game with this many bugs.
 
Take d3t to court over a couple of bugs? in a video game? that they are slowly but surely addressing and patching? C'mon son.
 
RunningWolf said:
Did you even play these games! I'm getting bugs all the time. Anyone that's actually played through this would know that it's a mess. I think someone should take this company to court. It's unacceptable to release a game with this many bugs.
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You'd end up taking the whole gaming industry to court based on this and other games that are/were buggy e.g. bungie for destiny 1 and 2 and Ubisoft for Assassin's Creed. Not saying the release then patch later mentality is right but it's the era we are living in and unless people stop buying games in their masses because of it, it's here to stay. It comes down to what the majority of users in games want to put up with and most carry on.

I'm not saying the amount of bugs in Shenmue HD is right & they should be fixed which they most certainly are.

Look at the quotes from Shenmue Master on Facebook from new comers, generally positive & again the post on these forums that I cited is again on the positive side. Again not saying that there aren't comments contrary to this but there's more along this line than not.
 
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I'm prepared to testify that I had two glitchy cutscenes and one crash to desktop when leaving a store. :ROFLMAO:
 
Kodama said:
This response alone proves my entire point, so I'm cool with it...
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Both reported posts were looked at and individuals spoken to.

All closed.

As a reminder, abuse on both sides of the argument will not be tolerated and please use the report button to flag anything.

Otherwise we hope that constructive posts are made to encourage good and respectful discussion.

Any personal issues should be left at the door.

Now back on topic please. Any more discussion around the ToS in this topic will be met with following of the procedures we have in place.
 
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RunningWolf said:
Did you even play these games! I'm getting bugs all the time. Anyone that's actually played through this would know that it's a mess. I think someone should take this company to court. It's unacceptable to release a game with this many bugs.
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This is satire, right?
 
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