List of what we learn in Shenmue 3

Machsi

Machsi

Joined
Mar 6, 2019
The game is gorgeous visually thanks to the powerhouse that is Unreal 4.

Although it plays like a classic Shenmue game, and is marketed to fans mostly as a nostalgic immersion in the old Shenmue experience, the one constant reminder we are seeing from longtime fans is how very little to nothing is learned in Shenmue 3. How the plot snails forward and it was ultimately unsatisfying at the end primarily from a plot and director decisioning perspective..

I overall did enjoy the game for what it was and can see there was some attempts at adding new information to the lore. I wanted to make a thread specifically to bullet point out what we DO learn in Shenmue 3, rather than what we don’t learn.

Please add to the list if I miss anything. Please note this is more of a data dump list and not in any semblance of chronological order.
  • Ryo’s mother’s name is Akame. Iwao sent her a letter regarding his return to Japan for her.
  • Lan Di was raised by the Chi You Men.
  • The mirrors were housed for safe keeping in a Cliff temple.
  • We received confirmation (maybe?) that the treasure may just be treasure. Scroll shows a picture of a pirate chest with gold coins with the Dragon and Phoenix.
  • Phoenix represents empress. Dragon represents emperor.
    Imperials requested construction of mirrors circa 1910. Mirrors function as key to Qing treasure, which is point of their existence
  • Verdant bridge made to honor their arrival to village.
  • Niao Sun is introduced as a new villian and takes ownership of phoenix mirror. Now Lan Di has the Dragon mirror and Ryo has no mirrors.
  • Shenhua has some sort of power, but it’s unclear. Hinted at making Mr. Muscles #1 talk.
  • Mr Yuan doesn’t know much, however, he informed us the CYM have taken over the Cliff temple.
 
That's about it. I was thinking about it the other day and you can really narrow it down to three things all of which you mentioned:

-The mirrors were created in 1910 (which appears to be at odds with the "ancient" legend and prophecy, I made a thread about how in Shenmue 2 Shenhua describes a legend in which the ancient emporer had mirrors created and many fought over them and lost their lives)
-Lan Di was raised by the Chi You Men after his father died (interesting but not earth-shattering revelation)
-The mirrors were once kept in the cliff temple (which doesn't make a ton of sense since the treasure is supposedly located there too)

So 2 out of the 3 reveals above conflict with other information we've learned and don't make a ton of sense (not yet anyway)

The only other plot development that occurred is that Niao Sun was barely introduced and took the Phoenix mirror from Ryo.
 
Rei_RICE said:
Niao Sun holds the Phoenix Mirror.
Shenhua, go with the one who holds the phoenix and find the proof.

-> So she have to leave Ryo now and go with Niao Sun. °_°?
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I would totally ally myself with Niao Sun over Lan Di.... who -and let's face it- is indeed a fool.

Anyway we also learned that the man in the old picture with Iwao is Zhao Sunming... this was never actually confirmed in the previous games.
 
We learn that Niao Sun's ambition is to rule the Chi You Men, hence her attempt to kill Lan Di. From this we can expect a Chi You Men civil war in Shenmue 4, assuming that Lan Di survives. While it is highly unlikely that he will die (the guy virtually has plot armour), his survival is not confirmed, nor the condition he will be in if he does survive).

We also learn a little about Niao Sun as character. Not only is she exceptionally clever, she is ambitious, manipulative and high skilled in the art of disguise.

Some more information regarding Zhao Sunming is revealed. We learn that he wanted to protect the mirrors from the Chi You Men and hence was entrusted with them. He then died in mysterious circumstances.

We also get a different take on Iwao Hazuki from Master Feng. Up to this point, we had nothing to suggest that he did not murder Zhao Sunming. In fact, his letter to Ryo and Zuh's words (when Ryo asserts his belief that his father was not a murderer), "I would like to believe that was the case", actually give us reason to believe that he did. However, Feng's assertion that Iwao was 'not capable of murder', gives us reason to believe that he may not have murdered Zhao and that if he did kill him, he had just cause and it was not done in cold blood.

While, as has already been stated, the story seems to have moved away from the whole, mirrors can resurrect Chi You, idea. Nothing in Shnemue 3 is said that stops the term treasure from being a metaphor for something else. In Shenmue 2, Zuh's words are that they (the mirrors) will unlock the treasures that will resurrect the qing dynasty. In Shenmue 3, while the term treasure is used, there is nothing concrete that suggests it is just a pile of gold. I do not consider the drawing on the map to be proof as the pile of gold could easily just be symbolic.
 
Niaxi said:
We learn that Niao Sun's ambition is to rule the Chi You Men, hence her attempt to kill Lan Di. From this we can expect a Chi You Men civil war in Shenmue 4, assuming that Lan Di survives. While it is highly unlikely that he will die (the guy virtually has plot armour), his survival is not confirmed, nor the condition he will be in if he does survive).

We also learn a little about Niao Sun as character. Not only is she exceptionally clever, she is ambitious, manipulative and high skilled in the art of disguise.

Some more information regarding Zhao Sunming is revealed. We learn that he wanted to protect the mirrors from the Chi You Men and hence was entrusted with them. He then died in mysterious circumstances.

We also get a different take on Iwao Hazuki from Master Feng. Up to this point, we had nothing to suggest that he did not murder Zhao Sunming. In fact, his letter to Ryo and Zuh's words (when Ryo asserts his belief that his father was not a murderer), "I would like to believe that was the case", actually give us reason to believe that he did. However, Feng's assertion that Iwao was 'not capable of murder', gives us reason to believe that he may not have murdered Zhao and that if he did kill him, he had just cause and it was not done in cold blood.

While, as has already been stated, the story seems to have moved away from the whole, mirrors can resurrect Chi You, idea. Nothing in Shnemue 3 is said that stops the term treasure from being a metaphor for something else. In Shenmue 2, Zuh's words are that they (the mirrors) will unlock the treasures that will resurrect the qing dynasty. In Shenmue 3, while the term treasure is used, there is nothing concrete that suggests it is just a pile of gold. I do not consider the drawing on the map to be proof as the pile of gold could easily just be symbolic.
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How’s this for a potential plot twist..... wait for it ..... wait for it..... Iwao DID kill Zhao.
 
Machsi said:
How’s this for a potential plot twist..... wait for it ..... wait for it..... Iwao DID kill Zhao.
Click to expand...

I'm not sure what the general consensus on this matter is, but until Shenmue 3, I was of the belief that Iwao did murder Zhao, for whatever reason he felt he had. And that his letter to Ryo explaining that he stood by the decision that he made. However, it is only after talking to master Feng that I am of the belief that if he did kill Zhao, it was not in cold blood.
 
Niaxi said:
And that his letter to Ryo explaining that he stood by the decision that he made.
Click to expand...

I totally forgot the letter and the words Iwao carefully picked... Stand for one’s convictions, live for one’s convictions, die for one’s convictions... that is how I lived my life...

Haunting words but if you think about the meaning, perhaps it fits that theory...Think about it: Iwao DID NOT deny to Lan Di he killed Zhao. He didn’t go “What are you talking about?!” ... his words of Zhao, it can’t be,YOU!?.... Iwao knew of Zhao’s son, who was only an 11 year old boy at the time. He expected his fate. I think Iwao did it for the greater good and my theory was at one point Zhao may have been corrupted by the treasure or power of the mirrors and maybe the CYM got to him somehow? Then weaponized his son?
 
This was somewhat buried in a datamining thread but I think warrants some discussion - the final notebook entries that you can't view since you don't get a chance to control Ryo in free mode again.

First step is to find Shenhua.

Chai attacked us again! He's a stubborn one.

Found Yuan and Xu locked up.
We rescued them.

Shenhua is next!
There's not a second to lose!

A strange woman was waiting for us.
We gave her the Phoenix Mirror to save
Shenhua. So glad she's safe.

The woman told us Lan Di is just up ahead...
Lan Di... I'm coming for you!

All that's left is to confront Lan Di!

Enemy after enemy keeps appearing.
I have to fight my way through them!

I finally beat Ge, the Red Snakes' boss!

Lan Di is up ahead.
This time, he's going down.

I found Lan Di's room!

I was unable to beat Lan Di. I lost again...

A disappointing loss, but I'm still alive
thanks to Ren.

Ren threw a fake Phoenix Mirror to help us
escape...

I'm just glad that everyone is safe.

The old castle went up in flames.
Who did this? Did Lan Di escape?

Ask Yuan if he knows anything.

Yuan told me about Zhao Sunming and my
father. Also the truth about the Phoenix
Mirror and why the Chi You Men want it.

Lan Di appears to be headed that way.
Click to expand...

Most notable is the final entry:

"Ask Yuan if he knows anything.

Yuan told me about Zhao Sunming and my
father. Also the truth about the Phoenix
Mirror and why the Chi You Men want it.

Lan Di appears to be headed that way."

Did I miss something? Yuan told Ryo about the truth beind the Phoenix Mirror and why the CYM want it? Must've missed it.

This game made it seem as if the treasure really is just a treasure, and all we really learn about the CYM's involvement is "they desperately want it" according to Elder Yeh. The CYM's motive and the consequences of them getting this treasure HAVE to be bigger than just getting rich though, right? I mean, sure they're murderous pricks and Ryo wants revenge, but Shenhua's father is rescued so her involvement could easily stop. She's obviously feeling tied to this prophecy, but there has to be something bigger at play here than just a pile of gold.
 
If it was really just treasure in the form of gold and stuff, it would seem kinda odd for the mafia organization to be called Chiyoumen.
 
hyo_razuki said:
If it was really just treasure in the form of gold and stuff, it would seem kinda odd for the mafia organization to be called Chiyoumen.
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Yes I feel it has to be. While the information we get seems to take the Chi You ressurection off the table, I am convinced that Zuh's statement about the mirrors 'being the key to unlocking the treasures that will ressurect the Qing dynasty' still holds true. Can anyone who understands Japenese confirm if the wording used whenever the treasure is discussed, indicates a large pile of gold or if it is used in a more symbolic manner?
 
Niaxi said:
Yes I feel it has to be. While the information we get seems to take the Chi You ressurection off the table, I am convinced that Zuh's statement about the mirrors 'being the key to unlocking the treasures that will ressurect the Qing dynasty' still holds true. Can anyone who understands Japenese confirm if the wording used whenever the treasure is discussed, indicates a large pile of gold or if it is used in a more symbolic manner?
Click to expand...
I mean, you could also argue the mirrors themselves are treasures. They definitely have functional properties beyond just having high monetary value and being pretty, so I assume the treasure they lead to is the same.
 
This has probably been mention aeons ago in the Shenmue 2 section of the forum, but it is worth noting that the set of lights emitted by the Phoenix Mirror at the end of Shenmue 2, are the same as the constellation that represents the Phoenix in Chinese mythology. From this we can probably assume that the Dragon mirror shows the Dragon constellation. How the paring of these two star patterns forms the map to the treasure, I have no idea. Although it is also worth noting that the North Star sits between them (the handle on the big dipper or dragon, pointing towards it). This may also link in with the poem when it talks about a single star shining after the whole Dragon and Phoenix thing occurs.
 
One of the lore things I really loved is that if you phone Goro from the Hotel, he says how Ryo has took on a sort of legendary status in Yokosuka harbour due to defeating the Mad Angels.

I know it's just a small throwaway thing but I really liked the idea of Ryo being some kind of legend in his hometown and that being completely unbeknownst to him.
 
It's also worth noting that Suzuki stated in the past that Yuanda Zhu may have been "lying" to Ryo to manipulate him. How this would play out in any future games (or also gets retconned/removed from the plot going forward) will be interesting to see.
 
Henry Spencer said:
It's also worth noting that Suzuki stated in the past that Yuanda Zhu may have been "lying" to Ryo to manipulate him. How this would play out in any future games (or also gets retconned/removed from the plot going forward) will be interesting to see.
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I need to re-watch those Shenmue Master interviews, as they managed to get a few interesting tidbits from Ryo. I do vaguely recall this one, but not sure if we should read into it too much - wasn't there another interview where Suzuki didn't even remember who Yuanda Zhu was?
 
The man in the picture is Lan Di’s father. If you look at the back of the picture, it says 白鹿村にいて meaning it was taken in Bailu Village, but the picture doesn’t say who the man is until Ryo shows it to a master.

You learn that Marc visits Ine-san and is planning to return home

Nozomi still has feelings for Ryo

Fuku-san is still after Akemi

Bromance between Gui Zhang and Ryo

Fangmei is learning Kung Fu
 
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