What a disappointment

But this is the way Yu planned it.
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I see this sentiment getting thrown around a bit on the forums lately, mostly as a response to any kind of criticism of how the story was handled.

Without getting into whether the story/game was good or not, this statement is simply false. While Suzuki might have some overarching points for the rest of the narrative it was definitely not planned out to the minute details. Suzuki himself doesn't even claim that. Not to mention how many times the story has changed or things being cut/added during development. 18 years on the back burner definitely changed some things too.

And saying this is how Shenmue 3 is supposed to be makes no sense. The entire area of Niaowu was added. It was never part of the original 11 chapter story, nor were many of the characters introduced i.e. Mr. Muscles. Even new ideas like Baisha were planned and completely cut from the game.

I'm not saying that none of it was planned, because some ideas that were scoped in the 90's definitely made it into the story, but this is not 'how Yu planned it'.
 
Also Yu didn't write actual dialouges and scripts, he just wrote the story. A good book doesn't automaticly convert into a good video game.
As per kickstarter M. Yoshimoto wrote the scripts for the original shenmue. Do we know as per Credits that he is also responsible for the S3's?
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kaliskonig91 said:
...How would that change bad writing though? Either the original draft was better or the original draft is the same (which it isn't. That's just facts). Either way that wouldn't suddenly make Shenmue 3's low points "good".
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Xanatus said:
Also Yu didn't write actual dialouges and scripts, he just wrote the story. A good book doesn't automaticly convert into a good video game.
As per kickstarter M. Yoshimoto wrote the scripts for the original shenmue. Do we know as per Credits that he is also responsible for the S3's?
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I think with Shenmue, the story goes hand in hand with the gameplay and locations. So if this game due to the limited budget, had to have some areas taken out like certain villages or cities then yeah the parts of the story linked TO those cities will obviously not be in this game. They will have to be carried over to the next.
 
TwiceFriedRice said:
People defending the story just can't seem to grasp the concept that it's not so much about what isn't there as what IS there. The quality of the writing is a legit criticism.
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The villains in the last two games weren't some sort of deep thing like people are trying to make them to be.
The best parts of Shenmue were Ryo's interactions with the people he cared about and that is still reflected in this game with Shenhua and also the telephone calls. Everything outside that is your basic revenge quest story; its not that deep....

The game's budget has an effect on what areas can be put into the game and with those areas comes more story revelations. The stories are linked to the areas.
 
Budgiecat said:
The villains in the last two games were some sort of deep thing like people are trying to make them to be.
The best parts of Shenmue were Ryo's interactions with the people he cared about and that is still reflected in this game with Shenhua and also the telephone calls. Everything outside that is your basic revenge quest story; its not that deep....
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Another strawman. This seems to be a recurring theme with the ones who can't seem to understand why people think the storytelling in this game was poor.

No one ever accused Shenmue's writing of being particularly deep, and I certainly didn't.
 
I just checked the credits by the way. Dispite Kickstarter claiming M. Yoshimoto was on board, he wasn't and got presumably replaced by:

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Guess that's the noticeable issue here. New guy with possibly little background of the old games. Also couldn't find anything about him (at least in english writing). Dunno Hiragana, but would be interesting to see if he is even known enough in the industry to replace a legend like Yoshimoto.
 
Xanatus said:
I just checked the credits by the way. Dispite Kickstarter claiming M. Yoshimoto was on board, he wasn't and got presumably replaced by:

View attachment 5971

Guess that's the noticeable issue here. New guy with possibly little background of the old games. Also couldn't find anything about him (at least in english writing). Dunno Hiragana, but would be interesting to see if he is even known enough in the industry to replace a legend like Yoshimoto.
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I looked for that when I finished the game, but missed it. I had a feeling something was fishy. Either way, I can't believe Yu signed off on the script.
 
Budgiecat said:
The villains in the last two games weren't some sort of deep thing like people are trying to make them to be.
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Yes but the thing is Terry had 70 men backing him up and at least made his presence and pull be known. In this one we have a guy with 2 lackeys and another with like 7. None of which have alot of screen time outside of telling us to go train more. The angels legit caused some serious damage and were DROWNING PEOPLE in the sea including the brother of a friend you just made. On top of that they wanted you to break the legs of a friend. On top of that if you fail a QTE Terry bashes Guizhangs skull in with a Cement rod.
A lot of that energy applies to the yellow head gang too. You never get any of that out of any of the villains in 3. Not only are the gangs small, the crimes they commit are kind of lame. There are no heavy implications other than "they break shit and extort money". Against Shenmue 1 and 2's antagonists there is no point were the villains come off as friendly enough to just let you walk away after beating you in a fight.
 
kaliskonig91 said:
Yes but the thing is Terry had 70 men backing him up and at least made his presence and pull be known. In this one we have a guy with 2 lackeys and another with like 7. None of which have alot of screen time outside of telling us to go train more. The angels legit caused some serious damage and were DROWNING PEOPLE in the sea including the brother of a friend you just made. On top of that they wanted you to break the legs of a friend. On top of that if you fail a QTE Terry bashes Guizhangs skull in with a Cement rod.
A lot of that energy applies to the yellow head gang too. You never get any of that out of any of the villains in 3. Not only are the gangs small, the crimes they commit are kind of lame. There are no heavy implications other than "they break shit and extort money". Against Shenmue 1 and 2's antagonists there is no point were the villains come off as friendly enough to just let you walk away after beating you in a fight.
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The drowning was done offscreen and to Mark's brother as told by Mark. Yeah the Mad Angels were cruel and ruthless but that doesnt necessarily mean they were good fighters; just that they picked on the weak through intimidation.
 
Budgiecat said:
The drowning was done offscreen and to Mark's brother as told by Mark. Yeah the Mad Angels were cruel and ruthless but that doesnt necessarily mean they were good fighters; just that they picked on the weak through intimidation
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Thing is, they had that world building going for them. In Shenmue 3 the thugs feel more like game devices to enforce the training grind than actual character that serve a plot.
 
Xanatus said:
I just checked the credits by the way. Dispite Kickstarter claiming M. Yoshimoto was on board, he wasn't and got presumably replaced by:

View attachment 5971

Guess that's the noticeable issue here. New guy with possibly little background of the old games. Also couldn't find anything about him (at least in english writing). Dunno Hiragana, but would be interesting to see if he is even known enough in the industry to replace a legend like Yoshimoto.
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I thought something didn’t add up about the writing. How could Yoshimoto write great scripts for Shenmue 1 and 2 and such a poor script for Shenmue 3?

I was happy to know that Yoshimoto will be writing the script for Shenmue 3 but to come to know that he wasn’t the lead writer is bitterly disappointing.
 
Budgiecat said:
You're giving the Mad Angels way too much credit. Too much shine in your nostalgia glasses
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Not at all. I didn't even really like the Mad Angels all that much, and felt they ruined the pacing of Shenmue 1. But at least they had build up. At least they were somewhat developed and the threats and reasons for going after them were clear. In Shenmue 3 it just feels so much more bare bones. The thugs feel disposable, have virtually no dialogue, pose no threat. It feels like Suzuki wanted the plot to revolve around his gameplay loop rather than the other way around.
 
hmjohnny said:
Not at all. I didn't even really like the Mad Angels all that much, and felt they ruined the pacing of Shenmue 1. But at least they had build up. At least they were somewhat developed and the threats and reasons for going after them were clear. In Shenmue 3 it just feels so much more bare bones. The thugs feel disposable, have virtually no dialogue, pose no threat. It feels like Suzuki wanted the plot to revolve around his gameplay loop rather than the other way around.
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they were all plot devices.

at the end of the day these are video games not paperback novels.

I like the gameplay loop.

If I see Virtua Fighter ever makes a comeback and then people start complaining how the new story of it doesnt live up to the instruction manual backstory lore then I dunno what I'll do lol
 
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