Magic Monaco Press Conference March 9th Part 3 More Reaction

[Tosh]

As for the rest of the trailer as others have already said I'm satisfied with it overall but I don't see it being particularly enticing to newcomers. Hopefully we'll get higher quality trailers in the future that could get more newcomers interested.

i said something about the Shenmue 3 newcomer topic in the other thread. i post it in here.
i think we all want Shenmue 3 to succeed, but im also pretty sure that Shenmue 3 is a pure fan game.
it took them 14(?) years to have enough confidence to begin with the next title.
the old publisher wasnt interested anymore, fans had to provide start up aid
otherwise the game budget would be something like 4-6 mil and not 10-15.

this is the third title in the series that is all about story. all the people who were too young for Shenmue 1+2
are completely out of that bubble and 98% of them wont play the re release.
not even all of the people who bought the re release finished it.
you can see in the PS4 trophies that only 25-28% of all PS4 players finished the S1&2 re release.
and a lot of them probably were already fans.

chances are low that a lot of new players will start with a game that has a 3 in the title.
most of the critical opinions about the new trailer are from people who know the old Ryo, Shenhua and so on,
so most of them are already fans.
Yakuza 1-5 were fan games too. the real worldwide push or hype only started with Yakuza 0
because it was a brand new PS3/PS4 game and a title where everyone could start and then experience all the other titles.

thats not really possible with Shenmue 1-3.
so even if they polish Shenmue 3 a tiny bit more and show some cool gameplay videos and so on
im pretty sure it will only catch a small amount of completely new players.
it was the fans mission to get a re release of S1+2 and it will be the fans mission to make S3 a success.
dont count on gamers of the triple A market.

 

[Spaghetti]

I will forever think thats ridiculous that at this point in time they can only show the press footage of the actual game but not everyone else.

Press-only previews are still very much part of the game PR cycle. There have definitely been variations and alterations, but it's still part of the publisher's toolset for controlling information.

EDGE got the exclusive, now it's getting spread to other outlets.

 

[ShenmueTree]

Press-only previews are still very much part of the game PR cycle. There have definitely been variations and alterations, but it's still part of the publisher's toolset for controlling information.


EDGE got the exclusive, now it's getting spread to other outlets.

I am not really upset there is press only previews, I am upset there are no public gameplay clips. They arent mutually exclusive.

Many games have press only stuff and there are write ups about it but most games at least have some actual gameplay shown to the public beforehand.

 

[Spaghetti]

I am not really upset there is press only previews, I am upset there are no public gameplay clips. They arent mutually exclusive.

Many games have press only stuff and there are write ups about it but most games at least have some actual gameplay shown to the public beforehand.

Not quite sure about all that, there are still very much private gameplay demos that may/may not go public at some point in the future. Who knows, we could be seeing it ourselves in due time. Much like the Cyberpunk demo that was talked up so heavily from private press screenings... though I dunno if it was ever explicitly in the PR plan for it to get released after, or if it was just a consequence of the hype.

But it's splitting hairs really, there's no rulebook for any of this and a publisher can be selective with what info gets out and when all they like. I'm not saying I like it, or that I'm even defending it really, but it's not new or abnormal.

 

[DigitalDuck]

Also why did Cedric ask fans what they wanted to see and say there would be actual gameplay if there isnt any (besides the footage for press)

The trailer has gameplay.

 

[ShenmueTree]

Not quite sure about all that, there are still very much private gameplay demos that may/may not go public at some point in the future. Who knows, we could be seeing it ourselves in due time. Much like the Cyberpunk demo that was talked up so heavily from private press screenings... though I dunno if it was ever explicitly in the PR plan for it to get released after, or if it was just a consequence of the hype.

But it's splitting hairs really, there's no rulebook for any of this and a publisher can be selective with what info gets out and when all they like. I'm not saying I like it, or that I'm even defending it really, but it's not new or abnormal.

It's pretty abnormal for a co producer of a game to hype up an epic gameplay trailer of a much anticipated game at an event their company sponsers, actually, owns, without there actually being any real gameplay (5 seconds of training is disingenuous at best) in said gameplay trailer where meanwhile at the same event the game's creator is showing press only screenings. And yes, I understand that that is Yu Suzuki's choice to only show select people but the surrounding circumstances makes it not very normal, imo.

Anyway, I am very excited for the press write ups. Hopefully we get more info other than what EDGE saw.

 

[RetroLord120]

Ok, real question: Why doesn't Ryo look like my profile pic in-game?

 

[tylerthunderr01]

No this game will make it to the PS4 for sure!

Yeah, seeing Ryo so expressive was weird as fuck lmao.

And no offense to Cory but I think he's going to have a seriously tough time topping that VA for me, that was excellent.


A while back I was thinking another delay was still a very real possibility, and if that's what they decide to do, I fully support them. I was expecting PS5/Xbox Two versions anyways.

 

[orient]

Can we all just appreciate how incredible Shenhua looks in motion? I mean, wowsers.

I showed the trailer to a few friends (four to be exact) -- people who know my passion for Shenmue but have zero expectations and no skin in the game whatsoever -- and their reactions were really positive. No one even mentioned animations, no one seemed confused as to what was happening. Three out of four commented on how pretty the game looks. There was one negative comment and it wasn't even about the game...it was about the logo.

Tiny sample size, of course, but interesting nonetheless.

 

[RetroLord120]

Can we all just appreciate how incredible Shenhua looks in motion? I mean, wowsers.

I showed the trailer to a few friends (four to be exact) -- people who know my passion for Shenmue but have zero expectations and no skin in the game whatsoever -- and their reactions were really positive. No one even mentioned animations, no one seemed confused as to what was happening. Three out of four commented on how pretty the game looks. There was one negative comment and it wasn't even about the game...it was about the logo.

Tiny sample size, of course, but interesting nonetheless.

They have animated shenhua perfectly, and she really does look alive. I feel like they are still implementing the animations, so people do not have to worry. Shenhua's voice is synced perfectly, so I'd think Ryo's will be worked on. Also, did you see her hair? HOLY it looks amazing. A ton of detail and great texture work on Shenhua. It looks amazing!

 

[chronopolis]

i said something about the Shenmue 3 newcomer topic in the other thread. i post it in here.
i think we all want Shenmue 3 to succeed, but im also pretty sure that Shenmue 3 is a pure fan game.
it took them 14(?) years to have enough confidence to begin with the next title.
the old publisher wasnt interested anymore, fans had to provide start up aid
otherwise the game budget would be something like 4-6 mil and not 10-15.

this is the third title in the series that is all about story. all the people who were too young for Shenmue 1+2
are completely out of that bubble and 98% of them wont play the re release.
not even all of the people who bought the re release finished it.
you can see in the PS4 trophies that only 25-28% of all PS4 players finished the S1&2 re release.
and a lot of them probably were already fans.

chances are low that a lot of new players will start with a game that has a 3 in the title.
most of the critical opinions about the new trailer are from people who know the old Ryo, Shenhua and so on,
so most of them are already fans.
Yakuza 1-5 were fan games too. the real worldwide push or hype only started with Yakuza 0
because it was a brand new PS3/PS4 game and a title where everyone could start and then experience all the other titles.

thats not really possible with Shenmue 1-3.
so even if they polish Shenmue 3 a tiny bit more and show some cool gameplay videos and so on
im pretty sure it will only catch a small amount of completely new players.
it was the fans mission to get a re release of S1+2 and it will be the fans mission to make S3 a success.
dont count on gamers of the triple A market.

Yeah i saw that post actually. The thing is, I don't think there's any excuse not to try to bring in new players. Why spend so much time and energy into what will undoubtedly be a good game only to limit it's success by screwing up on the marketing/presentation side of things ?

That could literally be the difference between getting a Shenmue 4 done or not. I know positive review scores will help with sales but i just feel like they've been shooting themselves in the foot with the way they've been portraying the game up until now (environment screenshots aside; they've been nailing those).

I'm not saying they should've spent a lot of money on marketing experts but surely they could've found someone that could tell them: "You know, I dont think you should show that. That looks a bit rough. Maybe you could show this instead".

 

[Space Lion]

@danielmann861]
You missed the part where I humbly ate crow and said it’s more along the lines of exaggeration and stereotype and that calling it caricature was wrong on my behalf, didn’t you?

The character is an exaggeration. It is a stereotype. The only Italian guy in town has a big moustache, typical exaggerated Italian look and speaks like Mario. Yeah, that’s what I’d call borderline stereotyping. That’s like the one Black guy in South Park who sings soul songs of the 70s and gets a whole lot of loving

Again, caricature was indeed the wrong word and I already ate crow on that, I’m wrong and admit I’m wrong, but the character is not far off exaggeration and stereotyping.

I’m not saying you have to like it or you can’t criticism it. I’m just saying exaggeration has perhaps always existed to a point in Shenmue.

I know it's a stereotype. But a stereotype isn't an exaggeration. Mario is an Italian man with a big nose. Those people exist. That doesn't make it an exaggeration.

Here's an Italian man.

Having a big nose is fine. People have big noses. That's not an exaggeration as it exists in real life.

But everything about this guy is an exaggeration taken to the extreme:

Wide frog face, big nose, long lips, small eyes, big cheeks, massive jaw. He barely looks human. It falls beyond a stereotype and goes into caricature territory. Most people have one or maybe two of these features but few would have all of them to that degree.

Again, this is all about preferences.

I understand why some are bringing up old Shenmue characters as a point of comparison.

The scout in II has a round face, thick lips, wide nose but his features are proportionate. He looks like a regular portly man.

Notice Scout's chin and jaw aren't exaggerated and his face isn't too wide. He's just stocky. Everything about the guy who got his house trashed is an exaggeration. He's a caricature. Also , by your argument, Ryo's own eye lid less Japanese eyes would be a stereotype.



Again, this isn't inherently bad but it's preferences. I find it sticks out amid the realistic environments. I have always maintained that Shenmue's realism is a big part of its appeal, at least to me. So I find this change a bit much.

I would have greatly preferred if the game stayed realistic while making the npcs not so detailed. Some have said it's a case of not having an AAA budget but I don't think that's the case. This is clearly an artistic decision and one I happen to disagree with.

Yakuza 0 by comparison.

This is a game made for PS3 btw and are the standards I expected. Realism within a realistic environment.

I don't expect every model to look as good as the rest of the cast. I do expect them to fit within the world of Shenmue and realistic environment.

You can tell the game was done on the cheap. It seems they've played a greater emphasis on environments than models. That's fine and their choice.

 

[Space Lion]

And yes, Shenhua looks incredible while in motion!

I didn't like this. The sound effects and the transition felt anime.

 

[Spaghetti]

Can we all just appreciate how incredible Shenhua looks in motion? I mean, wowsers.

Not just in motion!

Shenhua confirmed for cute.

You can tell the game was done on the cheap.

This is rubbing me up the wrong way in a pretty considerable fashion, unfortunately.

Shenmue III being lower budget is fact none of us can deny, but this is maybe taking your distaste with the more exaggerated models to an extreme. They didn't "cheap out" in making this aesthetic decision. You may not like them, but the exaggerated characters are well realised and rendered within the game.

 

[高野和泉]

I was hoping fan-favorite NoconKid would have a much better influence/role in the character modeling scheme of things since he manage to bring S1 into UE without compromising on the visuals 2 much in his HD fan-remake. Last I heard, he was relegated to enviroment/item designs exclusively? Also Nagoshi was the Cinema/film school alumni AM2 guy they had 4 cutscenes consultation in SI&II which really helped produced beautiful state of the art in-engine cinematography without resorting to Pre-rendered or FMV. I'm hoping Yu has someone of equal or greater talent on the team. I'm holding my breath & hoping the final product will reflect it consistantly.

 

[RetroLord120]

I don't hate the big guy design, its just that he looks like he is from Dragon Ball or something.

 

[Spaghetti]

I was hoping fan-favorite NoconKid would have a much better influence/role in the character modeling scheme of things since he manage to bring S1 into UE without compromising on the visuals 2 much in his HD fan-remake. Last I heard, he was relegated to enviroment/item designs exclusively?

Playing to his strengths, IMO. NoconKid's Ryo was basically the All Stars model, wasn't it? I was never massively hot on it to be quite honest, and I think Ys Net have certainly done fine for themselves creating a new model from scratch.

 

[Space Lion]

I was hoping fan-favorite NoconKid would have a much better influence/role in the character modeling scheme of things since he manage to bring S1 into UE without compromising on the visuals 2 much in his HD fan-remake. Last I heard, he was relegated to enviroment/item designs exclusively? Also Nagoshi was the Cinema/film school alumni AM2 guy they had 4 cutscenes consultation in SI&II which really helped produced beautiful state of the art in-engine cinematography without resorting to Pre-rendered or FMV. I'm hoping Yu has someone of equal or greater talent on the team. I'm holding my breath & hoping the final product will reflect it consistantly.

View attachment 2312

I feel the exact same way but it's a massive what if at this point. We'll just have to cross our fingers.

 

[Suzuki Yu]

BTW i like the subtitle font and size.
hopefully this is how it will look like in-game.

 

[Zoyous]

I know it's a stereotype. But a stereotype isn't an exaggeration. Mario is an Italian man with a big nose. Those people exist. That doesn't make it an exaggeration.
.
.
.
I don't expect every model to look as good as the rest of the cast. I do expect them to fit within the world of Shenmue and realistic environment.

I thought your final post on the topic was a while back? ...you literally announced you'd said your final word about it.