SuperEyePatchWolf: "Shenmue III is a terrible game and I've wasted my life"

It wasnt a good game. A 1 hour video released a year later doesnt change that. Plenty of series have had bad games within them(MGS,Pokemon,Zelda) so these things happen.
 
mjqjazzbar said:
The localization’s got to go. Rewatching the dialogue in this video is just painful. It’s pitiful.


at least it elicits some kind of emotional response from the audience after three games of going on a big chase that feels like it’s going nowhere. Like the dude who made the video said, it would’ve given us some needed payoff after enduring 20-30 hours of tedious busy work and given the moves you learn some meaning. I don’t see much positive feedback on the ending in this community or elsewhere, so I can’t say Ys Net succeeded with their ending either.
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But it would be completely artificial. A payoff for the sake of there being a payoff, so to speak.

In reality, this story has spanned less than a year. That an 18 year old martial artist can suddenly land a blow on one of the world’s deadliest martial artists is not in the slightest bit believable; especially when he couldn’t even touch secondary characters like Jianmin in S2.

The moves that you learn in S3 have a purpose elsewhere in the game, even if that purpose is a little unfulfilling. The idea that a move purchased from a martial arts shop in some random Chinese town elevates Ryo to some godlike level would cheapen what is admittedly an already cheap story.

I really haven’t seen many people that have had a major issue with the climax of Shenmue 3. Unfortunately the same can’t be said for all of the events leading up to it.
 
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That’s fair. I can’t easily come up with a fix for a story that isn’t even halfway complete, but I thought he hit some good notes on a superficial level and I felt somewhat of an emotional reaction while listening to him describe his ending. It certainly moved me more than anything that happens in the actual game. I found the negativity towards Yu Suzuki’s future and past the most objectionable part of the video. That’s just harsh for the sake of being harsh. I don’t think anyone should give up.

But man, this team really needs to hire some better writers. The dialogue and scenarios that play out in this vid. just aren’t acceptable anymore. The game looks like a relic with the nonsensical exchanges, which I admit might make more sense in the original Japanese, and the weird stuff like invaders taking over a town full of martial artists who seem unwilling or incapable of fighting them off. I get Ryo is there to be the hero, but let’s come up with some plausible scenarios, guys. It’s really hard to put my brain back in the 1999/2000 mindset and just accept what I’m seeing because it’s Shenmue. I’ve since played too many other games that are both immersive and tell great stories.

I figure if Shenmue IV happens it’ll play out like Shenmue III since a lot of what’s being recommended would likely require a brand new director and team, so I guess I’ve got to accept what’s coming, but it’s clear to me there’s much room for improvement and I hope the creative team is closely listening to feedback.
 
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spud1897 said:
The video itself is fine. The title makes me cringe a little bit but its nothing we don't already know and it wont impact much given Shenmue struggled for mass appeal anyway outside of the first game, it's not going to impact the game now. Though I query why wait nearly a year to do the video.
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He said he played the game twice before doing his review. There's no time limit to when someone must post a review. It's a good review and it's honest, there's no reason to try to discredit or discount it because it's "late". It still has a release coming on GoG and Steam so any and all reviews are still relevant. Not everyone buys a game in the first month, 6 months, or even the first year. I have games from 2016 I still haven't played.

parfait said:
It wasnt a good game. A 1 hour video released a year later doesnt change that. Plenty of series have had bad games within them(MGS,Pokemon,Zelda) so these things happen.
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How many of those series sat dormant for 18 years without a release? Shenmue 3 being a bad game is far more impactful than a poor Zelda release. Nintendo isn't walking away from Zelda like Sega walked away from Shenmue, or Sony, Epic and Deep Silver could walk away from Shenmue. Let's not pretend that Shenmue is a cashcow for any publisher...
 
Thomasina said:
He said he played the game twice before doing his review. There's no time limit to when someone must post a review. It's a good review and it's honest, there's no reason to try to discredit or discount it because it's "late". It still has a release coming on GoG and Steam so any and all reviews are still relevant. Not everyone buys a game in the first month, 6 months, or even the first year. I have games from 2016 I still haven't played.
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We can take what he said at face value and where did I discredit what he said? I'm just asking an honest question considering that 90% of reviews were done within the first 4-6 weeks of release and often in games reviews crop up before launch. He's a fan, his video on 1 and 2 is excellent and barring the title he is coming at it from his own, honest angle which is fine.

But does that mean someone who reviews the game in a positive manner is being dishonest or is that view differing from the person listening to it? Someone may say that this review is dishonest because it's negative (but well constructed). It works both ways.
 
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The video is less a review and more an analysis on his feelings towards the game. I guess the timing of the video’s creation or release doesn’t matter in that regard. It’s not everyday that I stick up for some YouTube clown, but considering this guy’s body of work, he isn’t some click-baity piece of shit like some are making him out to be. His videos are thoughtful and sincere, and in this case, it’s just unfortunate that he felt the way he did about a game in a series that we all love. Can’t hate him for that.
 
Your Boy Leroy said:
The video is less a review and more an analysis on his feelings towards the game. I guess the timing of the video’s creation or release doesn’t matter in that regard. It’s not everyday that I stick up for some YouTube clown, but considering this guy’s body of work, he isn’t some click-baity piece of shit like some are making him out to be. His videos are thoughtful and sincere, and in this case, it’s just unfortunate that he felt the way he did about a game in a series that we all love. Can’t hate him for that.
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Indeed not and his videos are well thought out. It's a shame he feels that way because from his older video it seemed he was looking forward to Shenmue III.
 
I think the problem with discussions like this is that whether we mean to or not, we end up living in a bubble where one thing seemingly creates a massive problem (and i'm no better). I will watch the video and see what I think, but the click-baity title is sadly a by-product in this day and age.

I was thinking about The Last of Us 2 and Deadly Premonition 2 and the issues they've had and try to get into the mindset of hardcore fans of those games. Do fans of DP2 upset and defensive when people point out the poor frame rate and anti-trans comments in the same way we get upset because people don't like Shenmue? I can't think of any game in recent history that has universally united gamers. In fact, I can't think of one in the history of games. It's quite easy for me to laugh at games like Fallout 76, because I never liked Fallout, but do hardcore Fallout fans get upset, because people are shitting on something they like? (It's not a like for like comparison, because Bethesda's practices are really shitty, but you get my point).

But some of us get upset, because for most of us, we have put a lot of ourselves into Shenmue, both financially and mentally. In some respects an attack on Shenmue may feel like an attack on us personally. On a bad day, reading something like the click bait article makes me think stuff like "oh, have I wasted my life?" or "why are they so mean about something that makes many people happy?" It doesn't happen all the time, but as someone who is quite sensitive, I do think that many vloggers and journalists don't appreciate that their words can sometimes hurt. 3/4 years on, reading an article saying that the film "La La Land" (one of my favourite films in recent years) was sexist and racist upset me thinking "Well hang on, this film meant a lot to me. Does that make me a sexist and a racist?" and of course it doesn't, but it still sticks in my craw. Anyway, I digressed.

My point is, what better way to get clicks then to go out of your way to get a reaction from people like us? I'm hoping there are some eloquent comments in his video that serves as some kind of balance.

As for me, Shenmue III is a 7.5/10 kind of game. When it clicked, I adored it, but yes there are issues. I'm game for criticism when it isn't hyperbolic.

In the grand scheme of things, I think we are putting too much stock into one person's opinion.
 
I think what makes this video important to the Shenmue community is this isn't just some random youtuber making clickbait or a Shenmue hater echoing the same things they've been saying since 1999. This was a fan of Shenmue to the point where he made a detailed video sharing his love of the series and his excitement and hope at the very existence of Shenmue III. And now here he is less than a year after III's release basically having a meltdown in a video because of how disappointed he was with Shenmue III.

Now some people might think that's hyperbole for the sake of youtube clicks, but honestly having been subbed to this guy for a while: I doubt it. This specific youtuber tends to speak from the heart on subjects he's passionate about, that's what his channel is built on, not cheap clickbait titles. Feel free to look through his other videos and you'll see that I'm right. I think he's speaking from the heart here.

So, like I said, the reason this is important is it's a genuine fan having a crisis of faith because of how Shenmue III turned out. I think every fan was disappointed by Shenmue III to different degrees, and I think this video pretty much captures that. If there is a 4, I'm betting this guy will check it out still, and I do really hope it satisfies him along with all the rest of us fans regardless of how we felt about III. People like happy endings but life has so few of them unfortunately.
 
Vasid said:
I think what makes this video important to the Shenmue community is this isn't just some random youtuber making clickbait or a Shenmue hater echoing the same things they've been saying since 1999. This was a fan of Shenmue to the point where he made a detailed video sharing his love of the series and his excitement and hope at the very existence of Shenmue III. And now here he is less than a year after III's release basically having a meltdown in a video because of how disappointed he was with Shenmue III.

Now some people might think that's hyperbole for the sake of youtube clicks, but honestly having been subbed to this guy for a while: I doubt it. This specific youtuber tends to speak from the heart on subjects he's passionate about, that's what his channel is built on, not cheap clickbait titles. Feel free to look through his other videos and you'll see that I'm right. I think he's speaking from the heart here.

So, like I said, the reason this is important is it's a genuine fan having a crisis of faith because of how Shenmue III turned out. I think every fan was disappointed by Shenmue III to different degrees, and I think this video pretty much captures that. If there is a 4, I'm betting this guy will check it out still, and I do really hope it satisfies him along with all the rest of us fans regardless of how we felt about III. People like happy endings but life has so few of them unfortunately.
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I’m sorry, but the title of the video is the very definition of clickbait.

Aside from being bummed out that someone I know to have been a big fan of the series hated the game so much, I take no issues with him disliking the game and share many of his opinions when it comes to some of the more poorly crafted areas of it, but there were times where his critique seemed incredibly disingenuous.

Take for example his explanation of leaving Shenhua’s house every morning. His video strongly implies that walking into the raised area of the house which triggers the cutscene of Ryo taking off his shoes is something that is very easy to do by mistake and yet in three playthroughs, I don’t recall ever walking up there by mistake (nor do I recall anybody else ever mentioning this).

I can see how somebody might do it once by mistake, but unless somebody has hooves for hands, it would be a very difficult mistake to make twice.

Furthermore, as a big Shenmue fan who played through the game twice, I’d be very surprised if he didn’t engage in conversation with Shenhua enough to have altered the morning routine and yet he chooses to replay the same clip repeatedly so as to suggest there is no variation whatsoever.

I do think that the team could have added a bit more variety in this regard, but hiding what little variety there was from viewers seemed like a deliberate attempt to make the game look worse than it is.

Then there’s his critique of cutscenes, which implies that the weird dips to black are present throughout the entire game rather than something which occurs only in the first five minutes.

I really could go on a lot longer, because pretty much all of his criticisms, whilst grounded in some truth, ended up being exaggerated or misleadingly presented.

As I said, there’s plenty to criticize when it comes to Shenmue 3 and I’m not going to argue with anybody for doing so (as I probably agree with them), but this video felt like a very deliberate attempt to make the game appear worse than it is for the sake of getting a few extra clicks and suiting his ‘Yu Suzuki done a bad game’ narrative.
 
So i've watched the video and I am in agreement with most people here in that - some hyperbole here and there aside - what he says makes a lot of sense. I even agreed with his suggestion of what his ending could be compared to what we got. I've only played the game once and have forgotten a lot of the things that I did find annoying (I did get trigger flashbacks on raising money...); I think it's broadly agreed that the fighting system, the hunger mechanics and the lack of plot progression is disappointing.

That said, he did seem to miss out on the smaller things that make Shenmue special such as the chats with Shenhua each evening. It was a nice touch to mention the Shenmue scrapbook which shows how much the games mean to us.

I think the difficulty with Shenmue III is that it was trying to do a lot with a little whilst simultaneously trying to feel like a Shenmue game which doesn't fit with a modern sensibility. It's a difficult balance that on the most part I think was successful. I'm not sure if I would prefer a more competent game that didn't feel like Shenmue or what we got. Hindsight is 20/20.

What I took most from this was he was being cruel to be kind. I don't think he wanted to hate it just to shit on it. I can't disagree with a lot of what he said, but I would be more understanding if he didn't need to resort to such a hyperbolic title. I've watched a few of his videos and thought that he gets his thoughts across very well without the need to use such hyperbole.
 
I still like the game. Warts and all.

Video said nothing new that hasn’t been said here or elsewhere since release.

I’m not saying the game is flawless and immune to criticism but yeah, I’ve heard these arguments on this very forum time and time again. It’s more of the same. “Why Shenmue III isn’t my Shenmue and what I would have done to make it better. Why the Shenmue III I built in my head for 19 years is better than what we got.”

It’s a reminder to me why I stopped paying this part of the forum attention. Because I kind of got tired of the negativity and the constant repetition of the same arguments.

Shenmue III is the perfect example of fans getting what they hoped for only to be inevitably disappointed because it wasn’t the game they built in their own head for 19 years or so. In short, it could never live up to ones expectations no matter what it did. I expected and accepted that when they announced the game as a Kickstarter project but it feels some within this community didn’t accept it and that is ultimately their own problem and still remains their problem.

I’m sure that will annoy some here but oh well. It’s honestly how I feel about it and honestly, it’s why I stopped paying this part of the forum attention. Because its a conversation that just goes in circles.
 
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I saw the title of this video and was slightly disappointed. I have watched many of this person’s videos and especially enjoyed his first Shenmue video. I bought a PS4 (basically) for Shenmue 3, and I don’t regret it now. But the first time I played through it, I was somewhat disappointed. I felt similar to what he is saying. So I gave myself a break for a few months, and came back to it when I had my head in the right place. Once I played it the second time, surprise, the problems were still there.

I’m not saying the game is either bad or good. I think the deciding factor to wether or not someone enjoys it is their mindset. This second play through is way more enjoyable for me, because I’m playing it like I did the first two. I have a routine, and I take things slow. And most importantly, I know where my expectations should be.

During the segment where he talks about getting money for the wine, I just had to laugh. How he explains it is so ridiculous, which, maybe it is. I never really had that big of a problem with money, mostly because I did work every in game day. That’s the big problem I have with his video. He talks about that experience as if it was designed to only work like that. There are so many different ways of making money in that game, and he focused on the most complicated method. But the rest of his points are very good, and illustrate some of the problems I also had with it, and probably what many other people had. The thing is, those problems don’t have to be game breakers. Sure, they can be annoying, but they can also be overlooked to a certain extent. Every person has their own opinion for wether or not they can enjoy it, even if there are a lot of flaws.

This video actually put things into perspective for me. In the end, this is one persons opinion, and he has the right to decide how Shenmue 3 affects him personally. If people agree with him, that’s fine, and if they disagree that’s fine too. As long as you don’t let a person on the Internet affect your enjoyment of a game, then it doesn’t really matter. And, as pointed out earlier, the reviews weren’t bad. Most people thought it was ok, so a sequel is still a possibility. One person’s negative opinion isn’t going to change that.
 
I re-read Eurogamer's review after watching the video and this quote really spoke to me:

There are lightly updated controls and a small selection of new systems but mostly it feels as if this was made soon after Shenmue 2's release back in 2001 then placed in a vault. There are the same inter-titles (though limited in appearance given that the world and its interiors are now seamless) the same menu fonts, the same QTEs and so many of the same idiosyncrasies that made Shenmue, for better for worse, what it was. This, like the originals, has a slowness that, if you're unable to lock into its rhythm, can seem outright audacious.

Whether you love or loathe that languid nature is a matter of taste, though either way know that Shenmue 3 slows the pace further still. Partly that's a reflection of where it finds itself in Ryo's arc.
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And I think that's something the video doesn't really explain or go into great detail. It's no different to watching either Lars Von Trier's Nymphomaniac or Rambo. Both are great films, but if i'm not in the mood for 4 hours of misery, then i'm not going to enjoy Nymphomaniac. Likewise, if I want something that's deep and cerebral, watching dozens of men get slaughtered in Rambo won't work.

So with Shenmue III, if I wasn't digging its rhythm, I would play an in game day, take a break, then play again later. When it did click, 3-4 hours would pass before I even realised.

And for what it's worth; i'm 10 hours into Death Stranding and I feel that game is wasting my time more due to its needless complexity. I needed to recharge a motorbike and I spent over an hour backtracking to the place where making the item to get it to work was mentioned. It turned out I was able to do it all along, but it was buried under dozens of other instructions. That's what bothers me more. I'm told it gets better, but I keep putting it off by playing other games.
 
bcdcdude said:
I re-read Eurogamer's review after watching the video and this quote really spoke to me:



And I think that's something the video doesn't really explain or go into great detail. It's no different to watching either Lars Von Trier's Nymphomaniac or Rambo. Both are great films, but if i'm not in the mood for 4 hours of misery, then i'm not going to enjoy Nymphomaniac. Likewise, if I want something that's deep and cerebral, watching dozens of men get slaughtered in Rambo won't work.

So with Shenmue III, if I wasn't digging its rhythm, I would play an in game day, take a break, then play again later. When it did click, 3-4 hours would pass before I even realised.

And for what it's worth; i'm 10 hours into Death Stranding and I feel that game is wasting my time more due to its needless complexity. I needed to recharge a motorbike and I spent over an hour backtracking to the place where making the item to get it to work was mentioned. It turned out I was able to do it all along, but it was buried under dozens of other instructions. That's what bothers me more. I'm told it gets better, but I keep putting it off by playing other games.
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This is definitely something that's not talked about enough in general when it comes to game critique. I love VNs/point and click adventures/etc, but sometimes I am just not in the mood for them and want to drill down on a shmup or something instead. Sometimes the opposite is true. I know if I force playing a game when I'm not in the mood for its pace, I'll ruin it for myself.
 
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