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- Nov 21, 2019
Relevant to this discussion:
The Order 1886 is like £8 on the PlayStation store. Worth a punt?
Yeah, it being short is one of the things that attracted me to it think I will give it a shot.I loved the time period, visuals and setting. It’s pretty short and has a lot of redundant gameplay sections which can be frustrating at times. Still I’d give it a shot.
Yep. Nagoshi's conditions were that Nintendo would back off and let them handle development or he wouldn't make it.That's kind of the opposite scenario, though. That was Sega taking a Nintendo property, and doing what they did best in order to make an actually fun game out of it.
Nintendo had the money, but Sega had the talent. Also just a bonus because Sega rules and n*ntendo drools:"If Nintendo planned to hold our hands through development, I would have suggested they develop the game themselves. That way we could focus on a project which would reflect our studio's abilities.
When asked about the differences in how Nintendo and Sega developed games, he would sum it up with Sega being more flashy and having a more light-hearted attitude when it comes to new ideas. Nagoshi says that if he started working at Nintendo instead of Sega, he would have already quit the videogame industry.
That's kind of the opposite scenario, though. That was Sega taking a Nintendo property, and doing what they did best in order to make an actually fun game out of it.
I'm not sure I really see your point on the audio thing. I was scanning through cutscenes from the game, and the only voice audio that seems consistently low is Eggman. Also instances where the BGM has vocals while characters are talking seems to be rather rare. Besides that, aren't there audio level sliders in the options? I recall the audio options for both Sonic Adventures being fairly extensive, even including dual-audio for voices.
Story, level design, progression, sfx use, English VA, treasure hunter stages? Yeah, SA2 is not my preference, but for some people it is. I'd agree that in retrospect I don't feel SA2 is exactly a 9/10 game, but it's not really a broken mess like Sonic '06 or Sonic Heroes, either.
Calling SA2 a buggy mess even in comparison to the first game...man I’ve seen everything now. There’s a bit of a difference in a game being straight up awful and being bad at a game and blaming it.
I'd at least like Sega give Sonic to another team at Sega.
Jet Set Radio and Super Monkey Ball seem more like a successful execution of the Sonic formula in 3D than any 3D Sonic tbh. It's all about momentum and using your environment to keep your momentum up, not pure speed.
I'd love to see Nintendo develop a Sonic game; or I'd at least like Sega give Sonic to another team at Sega. The Sega idea would've probably worked better if studios like HitMaker and Amusement Vision were still around. I'm not even a Nintendo fan-boy--I swear! I just really believe Nintendo does their best when they make a first party game, and I find it unfortunate Sonic Team did not live up to those same standards.
Playing the Crash trilogy right now. The first Crash Bandicoot is like the perfect 3D platform-er. Linear, clean visuals and challenging. I was breaking into a sweat playing a couple levels last night... Just the way I like it.
Yeah, I touched on JSR showing how rail grinding should be done in the three hour rant I wrote than no sane person will ever read.
I always felt like the Genesis Sonic games, Nights Into Dreams, and Jet Set Radio had a similar feel to them because of that. All fantastic games.Jet Set Radio and Super Monkey Ball seem more like a successful execution of the Sonic formula in 3D than any 3D Sonic tbh. It's all about momentum and using your environment to keep your momentum up, not pure speed.
Perhaps you don’t love Mario, but I really don’t see how you can argue 3D Mario games have not generally advanced the platformer genre or been developed with the utmost care and quality. I’m not exactly sure what Sonic Team has achieved with the 3D Sonic series beyond damaging Sonic’s reputation with most gamers.
The 2D games are something else entirely. 3D Sonic is a huge disappointment compared to what Sonic Team achieved on the Genesis.
I enjoyed Sonic Adventure 1 & 2 enough when they were new, but they aged terribly and the ports a couple years later proved the games didn’t have much staying power. The side characters were an interesting/fun thing in the first game, but signaled a bad direction that the series really hasn’t shaken even two decades later.Hopefully this will be the only time I go back on my word. However there are many things in this thread I can't resist addressing.
The original western release of Sonic Adventure was delayed a year to fix the broken Japanese version; Sonic Forces was also held back to fix its issues. So to say that Sonic Team does not care about the quality of their products is inaccurate; especially considering that they have to release their games according to their publishers at SEGA.
If we're going to start using glitches and bugs in video games as a metric to judge a games quality, then the vast majority of video games (including Mario) are bad. Outside of Sonic the Hedgehog 2006, none of the bugs found in the majority of Sonic games are game breaking. I find using this argument to berate Sonic games alone to be utterly hypocritical.
When it comes to the automated sections in Sonic games, they have always been around. Unless you want to overlook the short transitions in Sonic 2's Chemical Plant or Sonic 3 and Knuckles Flying Battery Zones. The difference is in their length as they have progressively gotten worse in more modern titles. That being said, the critique about the Adventure games being too automated is exaggerated in my opinion.
Also, I think a lot of gamers romanticize the Genesis Era of Sonic. Most fans only remember the big three titles and forget about Team Chaotix, Sonic R, Sonic Fighters, etc. that were considered mediocre, underwhelming, or bad. Even among the big three, its usually down to just Sonic 3 and Knuckles with the original Sonic the Hedgehog game considered to be the worst.
It's fine if you never enjoyed the Adventure games (though Adventure 2 was one of the last Sonic games Yuji Naka worked on before leaving SEGA), but I largely disagree with your opinion. The original Adventure titles for the Dreamcast received near unanimous praise in the late 90s/early 00s. It was only when games like Shadow the Hedgehog and Sonic the Hedgehog 2006 were released that a lot of gamers retroactively assumed the Adventure titles were bad simply by association (something that isn't helped by the horrible ports of the Adventure titles SEGA has released over the years).
Also, I think the Adventure formula could work for contemporary audiences. All one needs to do is to take a look at the Project Heroes fan-game which combines some classic Sonic gameplay with the Adventure style.
Sonic R is great once you get the hang of the controls and start using the analog shoulder buttons.^ Great post, but I'm going to have to be the retard and say it: Sonic R was awesome, just needed some more levels
I'm sure Mario 64 deserves some credit for movement within a 3D platformer space, but to me, the lasting legacy of Mario 64 is collectathons, and poor camera work. No cap, Mario 64 has one of the most garbage cameras I have ever seen in a 3D game. The controls aren't really a lot better. That's par for the course for early 3D platformers, though. I actually hate Mario 64 less now than I did as a kid. I just don't know how to derive any sense of fun from it. It's such a dreadful gameplay loop.Perhaps you don’t love Mario, but I really don’t see how you can argue 3D Mario games have not generally advanced the platformer genre or been developed with the utmost care and quality. I’m not exactly sure what Sonic Team have achieved with the 3D Sonic series beyond damaging Sonic’s reputation with most gamers.
The 2D games are something else entirely. 3D Sonic is a huge disappointment compared to what Sonic Team achieved on the Genesis.
Right, I mean, fair complaint if you're singling out Eggman. Perhaps his lines were recorded under less than optimal conditions that the audio engineers couldn't correct for. I'm really not sure about the dialogue overlap, though. Is this specifically in the levels, or during cutscenes? Both? I didn't watch through all of the cutscenes, but out of a decent sample, I really only noticed it once.Consistently low, yeah, but I find that just as bad. The fact that they could get it right sometimes makes the issues all the more baffling to me. And the dialogue overlap? C'mon...
I'm sort of with you that the quality, in hindsight, seems a little lacking. I'm just not on board with calling it a disaster.I'd consider it "broken" if it was unintentional. For me it wasn't, just very badly designed and implemented, so maybe I used the wrong word.
Rayman 2 is one of my favorite 3D platformers, also. I think I like Sly Cooper and the Thievious Raccoonus best, though.Personally, I still feel that Rayman 2 is the perfect 3D platformer; no Mario, Sonic or even Sony titles come close.