What a disappointment

I havent played the game yet, waiting for a complete version to dive in it.
(With all the lauch frenzy out of the way, also.)

Just from reading everyone here, I get a gut feeling :
Shenmue 3 is definitely shaping to be like Golen Sun 3 :
An awesome heart and potential with shortcommings.


Shenmue 3 don't seems like a bad game.
But, is it the worthy sequel you wanted : it's up to what you want.

I'm definitely blindly lecturing but :
Feel free to hate what you see as flaw as much as you want.
Once the dust settles, you can enjoy the gems all around.


For me : Such is the reality of any imperfect art shaped by its external constraints.
 
DynamiteCop! said:
My honest answer would be that entirely depends on the goal.

Is it trying to end the franchise? Is it going to be an actual push for story like 2 was?

The only way I would get behind it is if BOTH of those were what was being targeted, not either independently but both.
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That's absolutely fair. I honestly think if gets to 4 he's not going to finish the story there but that legitimate things will happen. This felt like a table setting episode.

I mean really just think about the first game. Honestly from a story standpoint I thought Shenmue 1 was a bigger offender than Shenmue 3. It didn't have you even face the final boss Lan Di (which either never or rarely happened in video games before). We didn't learn jack about Shenhua, we didn't even know if she existed. We never had a fight with Terry but a stinking QTE. Other than Guizhang and maybe Fuku the remaining characters were underdeveloped. Tom was best friends with Ryo? How were we supposed to figure that. We were also left with nothing but questions. Now in retrospect its fine because of Shenmue 2, but the first game set the tone for the series. It didn't stop me from picking up the second game and 3 won't stop me picking up the 4th one.
 
Yeah to me I'm hoping we look back on this game in 5-6 years in about the same way we (well, I should probably say "I") look back on Shenmue 1. There's a lot of novelty but the lightness in story will make it feel like it's a tech demo in the grand scheme. I'm pretty confident that Shenmue 4 can make the same narrative leap as Shenmue 2 now that the foundation is in place.
 
Tomato Convenience Store said:
Yeah to me I'm hoping we look back on this game in 5-6 years in about the same way we (well, I should probably say "I") look back on Shenmue 1. There's a lot of novelty but the lightness in story will make it feel like it's a tech demo in the grand scheme. I'm pretty confident that Shenmue 4 can make the same narrative leap as Shenmue 2 now that the foundation is in place.
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Seeing your handle does remind me of one disappointment for me. It's utterly unacceptable that there were no Tomato Convenience Store t-shirts for Ryo to wear. We got a Red Snakes one but no Tomato store one? Get the hell out of here with that mess.
 
After waiting almost 18 years and sinking over $500 for this game I completed Shenmue III today and I'm left slightly stunned and confused to be honest. Firstly I just want to say that I have so much respect for Yu Suzuki and the many generous, talented and hard-working people who helped to make this a reality. This is something many thought would never happen so it is a dream come true.

I'll try and keep this short. I loved the open world exploration and beautiful attention to detail in the locations with all the items and people, it definitely feels like Shenmue. Having said that, I felt the story really didn't progress significantly at all. Considering how long it took and how difficult it was to get a third game in the series, how many more can we expect realistically? I really expected this to try and tie up more loose ends so that if it is the last in the series, fans don't feel left in the lurch too much.

The end feels rushed and low on budget; completely understandable but could more resources not have been allocated to it instead of as much focus on mini-games and collectables. I would like more focus on overall story progression and decent cutscenes.

I will back Shenmue IV if it happens but I must admit to being left a little disappointed.
 
The budget limitations, I can understand. I actually thought they did a pretty good job with things like the fighting system. Also, Shenhua was amazing in this game. I was weary of there being a new VA for her but Brianna did the damn thing. Salute to her.


Onto on of my main issues, outside the story and awkward convos. The Red Snakes and Ryos interaction with them. They dont come off as threatening and for some reason Yu Suzuki thought to include comedic elements to the gang(on top of their already comedic appearance). For example, in one of the earlier fights back in Bailu village, after getting beaten by Ryo, two of the members quiver in fear, literally shout "yikes" before running away with their hands flailing, but not before clumsily bumping into each other. I half expected some scooby doo chase music to come on before seeing a Hanna Barbara logo pop up. It really takes the threat and the tension out of the game.

We went from a murderous drug trafficking gang and gollum like assassin in S1 to a murderous organized crime syndicate in S2 to a local crew of hoodlums who dine and dash, harass women and extort old people in S3.

In S1, the mad angels assaulted, threatened and kidnapped your friends and tried to send you to the bottom of the sea. We're made aware of their reputation several times throughout the game. Same with the yellow heads in S2, being starved to death and chased with a chainsaw, kidnapping friends and threatening to kill them. In S3, you get knocked out, get some Street Fighter-esque post fight quote and get to come back like you lost a fight at the training dojo.

I can deal with Most of the other stuff but never feeling like you're really in danger and therefore never felt a sense of urgency to get things done



I enjoyed the game still but cant say I felt fully immersed in it either. With that said, I'm still buying 4 if it ever comes out.
 
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Just finished the game. "Disappointed" does not do it justice.

A competent game, and a very good pitch for Shenmue IV, but it did not live up to expectations and is not a touch on the previous entries.

The entirety of the game felt very "bits and pieces" and the ending was terrible.
 
mjqjazzbar said:
It sounds like bringing back something that’s been gone for 15+ years is a mistake. This happens every time, no matter the fandom.. I can see why it took so long for us to get a third Shenmue. I just wish people would stop taking it out on Yu Suzuki.
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Honestly, I've been thinking that it wouldn't matter what they did...after 18 years...peoples expectations were never gonna be met no matter what they did. It's like the Star Wars fanbase...they all jump with glee that they're getting more only to rip it apart because it never meets their expectations of what they want from it. Or worse, they compare it so much to what has come before that they can't view it as its own thing. See the people comparing SIII with SII over and over. Which is kind of an unfair comparison at times.

If they did so much as one thing out of line then the fans would eat them alive. So I was kind of expecting this...I knew the fans were gonna be way worse than the critics when it came to critiquing SIII...but I think some people are being so damn hyperbolic about it. Yes, the game has issues, I am certainly not denying it. But the way some people are acting about it, you would think YSNET slit their dogs throats or something.

Anyways, I don't hate the game. I don't think the story is as bad as people are making it out to be. It's under developed and lacking in some of the things we wanted from it, but I didn't hate it. I actually kind of enjoyed some of the humour of it. Maybe I just don't have a stick shoved up my ass, but I will admit I laughed when Ren swiftly kicked the one body guard to the face at the end...it's totally in line with Ren's character :D I'm not above admitting I laughed at it.
 
Tomato Convenience Store said:
Yeah to me I'm hoping we look back on this game in 5-6 years in about the same way we (well, I should probably say "I") look back on Shenmue 1. There's a lot of novelty but the lightness in story will make it feel like it's a tech demo in the grand scheme. I'm pretty confident that Shenmue 4 can make the same narrative leap as Shenmue 2 now that the foundation is in place.
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This minus the S1 part. S1 is a fantastic game imho and a much better game than S3.

But my point is, what gives me hope is that there is a lot of potential in S3. The Shenmue Experience is there. I know a lot of people on here won't share my opinion on the combat system, but I thought even the combat in S3 was very, very serviceable. It's not Yakuza 0 or Yakuza 6, but S3's combat is really fun! If Yu could refine it just a little bit more for S4, we're good.

Yu needs to deliver on his story, finally deliver what story development he promised for S3 (S3 - All the Facts and Information thus Far thread here on the forums) .

Bring back Masahiro Yoshimoto. Why the fuck was he only an early contributor for S3? He could have made this game a masterpiece.

Don't focus on building a huge environment, no more new arcade and gambling games, just re-use the ones from S3. No new jobs, three is enough, just re-use those. Save your epic set pieces for stuff that's actually epic. No wasting money on purse snatcher qte chases. If that much money and work would have went into the Chai qte fight, it would have made sense. Tell your story!!! No fancy cut scenes needed. Make the characters talk about stuff that matters.

With S3's foundation and somebody who actually knows how to tell a story (Yoshimoto!!!) by his side, Yu can make a S4 that would even rival S2. If he gets his focus right, that is.

If he gets his focus right, Yu can make another masterpiece with the foundation we have now. I am 100% convinced.
 
Tomato Convenience Store said:
Yeah to me I'm hoping we look back on this game in 5-6 years in about the same way we (well, I should probably say "I") look back on Shenmue 1. There's a lot of novelty but the lightness in story will make it feel like it's a tech demo in the grand scheme.
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I think that part of the disappointment is that it feels like it's actively not trying to advance the story.
I got the game after knowing that a lot of people were disappointed by the story, and after 1 hour I was already anticipating that we wouldn't find Yuan till the end. But there was a lack of anything substantial inbetween.
It does sting more, because they got SO MANY things right, but fumbled a part that should be about the writing and not about budget (though I think that the training with masters sequences might have been cut off due to budget).

I might not disagree with the story of the first one being one big redherring, but you get a lot of info in the game, you learn that the mirrors were made in guilin, all the basic story about Lan Di thinking Iwao killed his father, learn about the chi you men, learn about the prophecy of the dragon and phoenix, learn about the hazuki crest, learn that you father travelled to china, get a general understanding of Ryo's present and past.
Even in the stuff that doesn't advance the story, like "finding chinese people" you get a nice tidbit about the three blades, or showing the mirrors to different people they give tidbits about chinese culture (and compare that to what would be a side quest in S3), or background on characters / the world.

And even if by analyzing the game on retrospective you understand that all you "really" do is finding master chen and he gives you the knowledge about the mirrors and Lan Di location, while I was playing the game I really never noticed that and felt like I was doing continuous advance. In Shenmue 3 you spend the whole game trying to find Yuan and some "thugs" and not even the "thugs" are developed in any way.

I don't think it's just from a fan perspective trying to get info about a story that has been lingering 18 years in my mind, I stumbled about this video (by the title I thought it was going to be more positive):
At 6:50 he says what he thinks about the story, and he doesn't seem to be a fan, so it's not like he's invested in finding out the "big plot", and it was how I was feeling the whole time (hell, even after you reach Niaowu you are still trying to find "thugs").

PD. HELL I just was refreshing my memory and I watched the bunkado antiques cutscene and he even tells you that an emperor ordered a sculptor from guilin to engrave a guardian on stone.
 
I Got Sriracha In My DNA said:
That's absolutely fair. I honestly think if gets to 4 he's not going to finish the story there but that legitimate things will happen. This felt like a table setting episode.

I mean really just think about the first game. Honestly from a story standpoint I thought Shenmue 1 was a bigger offender than Shenmue 3. It didn't have you even face the final boss Lan Di (which either never or rarely happened in video games before). We didn't learn jack about Shenhua, we didn't even know if she existed. We never had a fight with Terry but a stinking QTE. Other than Guizhang and maybe Fuku the remaining characters were underdeveloped. Tom was best friends with Ryo? How were we supposed to figure that. We were also left with nothing but questions. Now in retrospect its fine because of Shenmue 2, but the first game set the tone for the series. It didn't stop me from picking up the second game and 3 won't stop me picking up the 4th one.
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Would you honestly expect Ryo to face of with Lan Di in the first one though? He had hardly learned anything marital arts-wise and it would've been to soon to nust have them meet up and fight. Someone would have to inevitably step in or something would have to distract Lan Di long enough for Ryo to get away.

We weren't supposed to know much about Shenhua in the first one and she was supposed to be all mysterious until her and Ryo meet in S2.

I can agree on the Terry thing and even the Tom thing. Although, that might have been a script thing where even though Ryo said "you're mine too", he actually meant hes one of his best friends.

And seeing how S1 was the first in a series of games, the audience was supposed to have questions.
 
I've cleaned up the mass of double posting, for whatever reason they were posted.

Just make sure to clear the text box if you've noticed anything in there you dont want and I'll speak to the web guru to sort things.
 
Dehone said:
Would you honestly expect Ryo to face of with Lan Di in the first one though? He had hardly learned anything marital arts-wise and it would've been to soon to nust have them meet up and fight. Someone would have to inevitably step in or something would have to distract Lan Di long enough for Ryo to get away.

We weren't supposed to know much about Shenhua in the first one and she was supposed to be all mysterious until her and Ryo meet in S2.

I can agree on the Terry thing and even the Tom thing. Although, that might have been a script thing where even though Ryo said "you're mine too", he actually meant hes one of his best friends.

And seeing how S1 was the first in a series of games, the audience was supposed to have questions.
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You're speaking in hindsight with the knowledge of how the story unfolded so far. I'm not saying how I or folks feel right now. I'm talking what I honestly expected it in 1999 or 2000 and the feeling inbetween the period of Shenmue 1 and 2's release. Where in any video game before did you not face the enemy as the final boss or one of the final bosses? We're not talking about a TV series. Its easy to say in hindsight we should've expected that but in 1999/2000 unless you knew the spoilers everyone I was aware of was confused that Lan Di wasn't the final boss of the game. Or that the heavily promoted Shenhua only appeared in dreams. We were left with only knowing a sequel was happening and we weren't even sure how the dangling questions in Shenmue 1 were going to be addressed.

Shenmue 2 and the nature of the series put things into context, but considering the single installment nature of video games, Shenmue 1 felt very incomplete in 2000. We spent 15 to 20 hours playing a prologue.

Going away from how the events in the narrative unfolded, I do still feel Shenmue 1 had storytelling flaws as well. I can go over that further if you like but didn't want to make this post longer than it had to be so I'll just stop here.
 
1 week has passed since I finished the game and I’m still bewildered at how they did absolutely nothing with the elements that came out at the end of Shenmue 2.

The prophecy? Mentioned in the intro and that’s it.

The floating sword which connected with Shenhua? retconned and relegated to a key to activate the device at the top of the tower.

Shenhua’s father letter? Barely mentioned or discussed.

Ryo being the one? Doesn’t do anything special outside of fighting thugs and getting his ass kicked.

Shenhua’s special powers? Never discussed, and relegated to an off screen scene that never gets an explanation.

It’s almost like they completely missed what kept the fanbase thirsty for all these years, incredible.
 
Dehone said:
We went from a murderous drug trafficking gang and gollum like assassin in S1 to a murderous organized crime syndicate in S2 to a local crew of hoodlums who dine and dash, harass women and extort old people in S3.
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Naiowu/Chobu, from my understanding is based loosely on Fenghuang Ancient Town in Hunan province.
For the late 80's era, I would not expect local gangs from there to be of an example of dark forces (loosely-organized groups) or that of the type of black societies (more-mature criminal organizations). Two features which distinguish a black society (*and by black society I do not mean Black people lol its actually a term for higher organized crime syndicates) from a dark force are the ability to achieve illegal control over local markets, and receiving police protection, but both are examples of triads. Matter of fact, I would put these Red Snakes even under dark forces; just lowly thug gang that the Chi You Men hired on the cheap. Thats why Yongling at Bailu said he wasn't even allowed to see their faces when they were hired or else they'd be killed on the spot. These were just normal gangs, not triads.
From the 50's to the late 70's, Kowloon Walled City, a lawless area not controlled by H.K. or British gov't, was controlled mostly by Triads, hence their more intimidating presence in Shenmue 2. Their height of power was in the late 50's though. Bruce Lee, born in 1940, was around 18 years old in 1958 when he was training under Ip Man in H.K. learning Wing Chun, and used to get into a lot of street fights. Beating the crap out of a son of a local Triad boss is what prompted his father to send him back to the states to live with his older sister in Seattle for fear of retaliation. After the 1956 riots, the Hong Kong government introduced stricter law enforcement and the triads became less active, but their legacy lived on hence the popularity of them in media such as movies and Shenmue 2 and Sleeping Dogs.
Actually, when United Front visited parts of H.K to scout for research for their Sleeping Dogs game, they were guided around town by a local triad so they were still around even in our recent times, though obviously not as prominent.
Fenguhang? No business there for them really.
 
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Shenhua-Nani? said:
1 week has passed since I finished the game and I’m still bewildered at how they did absolutely nothing with the elements that came out at the end of Shenmue 2.

The prophecy? Mentioned in the intro and that’s it.

The floating sword which connected with Shenhua? retconned and relegated to a key to activate the device at the top of the tower.

Shenhua’s father letter? Barely mentioned or discussed.

Ryo being the one? Doesn’t do anything special outside of fighting thugs and getting his ass kicked.

Shenhua’s special powers? Never discussed, and relegated to an off screen scene that never gets an explanation.

It’s almost like they completely missed what kept the fanbase thirsty for all these years, incredible.
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Exactly. Let's imagine:
Prophecy and Ryo being the one - Ryo starts having odd dreams, like the ones he had in Shenmue 1. Stronger and oddly ones. With a martial arts training with Master Feng or Master Sun, during the training, although we keeping doing the commands right, some reactions and interruption scenes happening, like the ones Ryo and Xuying had when she asked to fight her. Suddenly a qte pops up and Ryo amazingly do the move, for the master became aware of his natural unachieved talent. Pretty much Kung fu hustle's Sing and his gift.

We have nothing to look in the house it's worthy. We can't go in at the room of the dude we're desperately searching. There could be one or 2 move scrolls and maybe 3 or four story itens wich triggers a cutscene, inside the room.

Ryo and Shenhua had dinner together in Shenmue 2. How a lower budget can make the team forget to repeat this, maybe with a side quest? God damn!!! Shenhua tells Ryo about a legendary fish wich can be fished in Bailu. Why didn't make it?!?!!! AT LEAST ONE!!!!!! Instead we got Faceoff. That's an insult.

Shenhua special powers:
Chatting with Shenhua, we know she talks to the animals. A great opportunity to a side quest. Shenhua invites Ryo to hunt at the montains. Something happens and Ryo almost got kill by a bear and is stopped by Shenhua. The bear suddenly stops and later Shenhua tells Ryo the bear was trying to protect her cub. He got stunned cause she tells him the bear told her. The final piece of the cut scene are the bear and the cub.

Seriously, I can't help my self. Sorry guys. I'm in really despair and pain. So much of a potential and now I feel it's gone.
 
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HazukiFCBR said:
How a lower budget can make the team forget to repeat this, maybe with a side quest?

Seriously, I can't help my self. Sorry guys. I'm in really despair and pain. So much of a potential and now I feel it's gone.
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budget + release deadline.

Remember: while this game had a small budget, even games with HUGE budgets can have things removed or not completed in time due to strict release date deadlines set by the publishers. MGS V is probably a perfect example of this. This of course happens to movies a lot too. (lol Snyder cut)

dont be depressed. Just be realistic and hope things improve. This game was a miracle it was even made on this indie budget. And the fact it looks the way it does despite that.
 
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Budgiecat said:
budget + release deadline.

dont be depressed. Just be realistic and hope things improve. This game was a miracle it was even made on this indie budget. And the fact it looks the way it does despite that.
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Man, every time i remember Shenmue 3, i wanna cry the hell out. I'm a realistic guy. I did not expect Shenmue 3 to be as good as Shen2. But, man. Seems to me, they were aiming for the "40 hours to complete" than a good satisfactory Shenmue kung fu tale game. I rather have had a good story driven Shenmue 3 with barely 10 to 15 hours to complete than the game we got. For me, wasn't budget at all. They misfired what this game is all about. And I say this with sadness all over.
 
HazukiFCBR said:
Man, every time i remember Shenmue 3, i wanna cry the hell out. I'm a realistic guy. I did not expect Shenmue 3 to be as good as Shen2. But, man. Seems to me, they were aiming for the "40 hours to complete" than a good satisfactory Shenmue kung fu tale game. I rather have had a good story driven Shenmue 3 with barely 10 to 15 hours to complete than the game we got. For me, wasn't budget at all. They misfired what this game is all about. And I say this with sadness all over.
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"JM: I play games to do things I can't do in real life. Do you think games have become too real? If you were to do Shenmue 3, for example, would you take the same approach and make it super realistic, or would you take a different approach?

YS: The concept for Shenmue 3 already exists, so... [Laughs] The world of Shenmue 1 and 2 expanded outward. So, for example, in the original games, of all the data used for dialogue in the game, the main characters' dialogue was about 20%. The remaining 80% was dialogue by characters other than the two main characters.

But Shenmue 3 doesn't expand outward, but inward. A lot of the dialogue is used for the main character and especially dialogue with Shenhua. They talk about a lot of different, deeper things. For example, and I can't say too much, but here's an example.

This is not actually in the game, but as an example to give you an idea of what I mean by deeper dialogue, when Shenhua and Ryo are at home, Shenhua will ask Ryo if he would like to drink tea or coffee and the player will select one or the other. Or, Shenhua will ask Ryo a hypothetical question like: "There are four animals; a monkey, cat, dog and bird. You are crossing the river but you need to leave one behind. Which one will you leave behind?" And the player has to choose one. Shenhua will ask lots and lots of questions like these and the answers will get stored in the game and affect the outcome of the player's relationship with other characters. It's like a personality test. For example, the person who leaves behind the monkey is the type of person who leaves their wife.

TH: That's scary. [Laughs]

JM: So it's more organic, and very contextual. Personally, I would leave the bird behind. The bird can fly across the river.

YS: It's very deep. I think it will be very interesting if it happens." - 2010 interview


Why am I posting this to you? Because it means since 2010 I knew what to expect from this game as it was already explained here in this interview.
This was always going to be more of a personal delve into the relationship of Ryo and Shenhua. The end of Shenmue 2 perceived this.

A lot of people wanted this game to show a vastly more 'outward' advancement of the plot but he explained nine years ago it wouldn't be. Some people even wanted this game to wrap the entire story up but we knew it wasn't going to do that either.
 
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